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karatecatman Guest
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Posted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:00 pm Post subject: Jet in trouble? High attrition |
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http://tinyurl.com/yw4wkb
Jet loses key senior staff, denies attrition is a problem
Quotes:
"About 370 staff have resigned from the airport services division and 270 cabin crew have quit in the ten month period from April'06 to Janu-ary this year,'' said an insider. Attrition rates are about 30% in these departments, as airlines such as Indigo, SpiceJet and Kingfisher have picked up several people from Jet.
One of the reasons for people leaving at senior levels is the complaint that expat consultants virtually run the airline.
As the reliability of the low cost airlines has improved, the at-tractive fares being offered by the LCCs are being snapped up by Jet's traditional customer base of corporate groups. |
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stuchil Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2007 Posts: 12
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 9:29 am Post subject: |
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be a shame to see Jet lose its vision if these key people are going. |
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Boeing7xx Member
Joined: 23 Dec 2006 Posts: 477 Location: WSSS
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:51 am Post subject: |
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Why am i not surprised... The fact that they pay the A330 guys the same as the 737 (with the rider "Oh ur getting wide body experience") and the fact that they have no pilot development policies why would anyone want to be there except for the fact that they are the only credible 737 operator (apart from SpiceJet) in India. |
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HAWK21M Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 8132 Location: Mumbai, INDIA
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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Currently due Demand.Salaries alongwith Airline reputation will determine the Exodus.
regds
MEL _________________ Think of the Brighter side !!! |
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sri_bom Member
Joined: 22 Dec 2006 Posts: 2365 Location: Singapore
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Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 11:49 am Post subject: |
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Jet exodus: Senior managers quit
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Shivnath Thukral
Wednesday, April 4, 2007 (New Delhi):
Naresh Goyal may have changed the way you fly but right now his senior management is making sure Jet Airways finds it difficult to fly as smoothly as in the past.
At least eight senior level managers have left the company, raising serious management issues.
"Jet no longer has any leadership, as there is too much of centralised leadership and a lack of empowerment amongst the management," said a Jet official who has left and wished to be anonymous.
"There are too many layers and bureaucracy has frustrated the lot which resigned," he added.
However, what takes the cake is how some of those who have left are citing the dominance of foreign expatriates who are being installed above the Indian managers ignoring their contribution of several years.
Foreign professionals
Naresh Goyal for several years has heavily relied on foreign professionals but they have stayed in the company for a very short period.
Amongst the Indians who have now left include Sharad Chandran, Vice President HR, Rajesh Verma, VP Customer Service, Vivek Pradhan, GM Catering, V Raja, VP, South East Asia, Michael Tan, Head of Training, Ravindran, GM Planning and Nandini Verma, VP Corporate Affairs.
What is interesting is that Jet's Singapore and Bangkok operations have no division heads as of now and as the list of Indians exiting the company increases, the list of expatriates being brought in at a high price is increasing.
For Naresh Goyal and his American friend Vic Dunga the coming few months will be quite a challenge, as competition is pushing him hard luring employees as well as taking away market share.
However, for investors may be it's time the Goyals give up the power centric management, which has seen the stock tank at the markets ever since it listed.
Source: http://www.ndtvprofit.com/homepage/storybusinessnew.asp?id=37402&template=
Sri_bom |
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D-ABTH Member
Joined: 22 Dec 2006 Posts: 837 Location: VABB :: BOM
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Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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its a problem definitely... simply because Jet continues to have this attitude that they can pay domestic level salaries... irrespective if their staff operate international operations... and therein itself lies the biggest problem...
you cannot go global but still offer renumerations as per your primary domestic levels..
in addition many of my friends in Jet are dissatisfied with Jets salary levels...even ground ops.. _________________ If it aint Boeing.. I aint going. |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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D-ABTH wrote: |
in addition many of my friends in Jet are dissatisfied with Jets salary levels...even ground ops.. |
But D-ABTH as far as attitude towards employees are concerned i feel 9W is the best among private carriers..recently i heard that a senior management opst holder in IT ( i dun't wanna name him) was flying IT economy that to J class was not at all more than 70% full, yet it is their company policy... (he was ON-duty) _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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VABBy Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 823 Location: DEL
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:56 am Post subject: |
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Avijeet attitude has got nothing to do with the salary levels or employee turnover. Remember they are being paid to be pleasent with u. As far as losing its top level management its all part of the game due to limitation of experienced human resources in the industry poaching is in full blow.
They got a better offer and wasnt much satisfied with their current work profiles so they moved on. Too bad for Jet that they cudnt retain them.
Its an old practise if u wanna evalute ur skills and experience which u have gained in the current company try to join its competitor.
As my HR head says Its easier to hire people bt very difficult to retain them. _________________ Expeditors- You'd be surprised how far we will go for you www.expeditors.com |
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HAWK21M Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 8132 Location: Mumbai, INDIA
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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Where Supply is less than Demand.......Salaries & perks are determining factors.
regds
MEL _________________ Think of the Brighter side !!! |
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Birendra Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2007 Posts: 1411
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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The team that left:
Sharad Chandran, Vice President HR
Rajesh Verma, VP Customer Service
Vivek Pradhan, GM Catering
V Raja, VP, South East Asia
Michael Tan, Head of Training
Ravindran, GM Planning and
Nandini Verma, VP Corporate Affairs
The main man who still weilds control and is MAN FRIDAY of Naresh is Saroj K.Dutta.
If S.K.Dutta leaves, then PANIC. |
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VABBy Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 823 Location: DEL
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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Well resignation of 8 ppl all belonging to top level management and handling diffrent affairs is definately an issue to worry abt . Who is going to handled these aspects nw. I guess its the board of directors who wud having sleepless nights becoz they need to ascertain whether the current middle level managers are able to take upon the task or nt and if nt then who wud fill in the vaccum.. _________________ Expeditors- You'd be surprised how far we will go for you www.expeditors.com |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:02 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | Avijeet attitude has got nothing to do with the salary levels or employee turnover. Remember they are being paid to be pleasent with u. As far as losing its top level management its all part of the game due to limitation of experienced human resources in the industry poaching is in full blow. |
Vabby...agree with you but it does matter to a certain extent.
I've heard of cases at IT where their managers think that IT is their parental property.
Besides 9W has lost them because they are not able to pay them... IT has much stronger finances thats why cases of people leaving IT are not that much.
The stronger war these days is between 9W and IT rather _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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Akshay Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 315 Location: Mumbai
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Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:42 am Post subject: |
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8 top officials quitting is surely cause for worry.
What happened of their image overhaul? There isn't a single word of it!! _________________ MRVC Mania. My blog dedicated to the new violet-white suburban rakes of Mumbai. |
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stealthpilot Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2325 Location: BLR, DXB
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:23 am Post subject: |
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the_380 wrote: |
Besides 9W has lost them because they are not able to pay them... IT has much stronger finances thats why cases of people leaving IT are not that much.
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Are you saying Jet Airways can’t pay their management…. so they left??
Where on earth did you get that idea from? _________________ eP007 |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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stealthpilot wrote: | Are you saying Jet Airways can’t pay their management…. so they left??
Where on earth did you get that idea from? |
Dude, IT pays the highest to its executives _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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Nimish Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2006 Posts: 9757 Location: Bangalore, India
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 2:33 pm Post subject: |
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I want to add a couple of thoughts to this discussion:
1. 9W has been a player for a very long time and have managed to retain their "quality", "branding" and "loyalty" at similar levels for ever. This is despite the standard churn that happens in any industry, and despite IT trying very hard to poach the top 9W fliers. This points to a possibility that 9W has probably invested heavily in process along with people. When the processes are strong and documented, the people themselves can be replaced in an easier way.
2. This movement of top 9W talent is probably good for the overall Indian aviation industry. 9W might have already groomed the second/third rung of leadership (any properly managed organization will have such HR processes in place), and might have the processes to deal with such departures. Hence they might not be significantly impacted in the short or long term. However other airlines that hire these managers will benefit from the fit/finish that 9W have given these people, hence raising the bar on the industry at large. |
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TKMCE Member
Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Posts: 957
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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Jet has had a higher retention rate of top officials than most , but then until DN and KF came on scene there was hardly any private sector competition in Inda of the scale of Jet for them to move on. Many of Jet old timers were recruited from IC and AI, and who stayed on for many years building a solid team. |
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stealthpilot Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2325 Location: BLR, DXB
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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the_380 wrote: |
Dude, IT pays the highest to its executives |
Fine, but you said
the_380 wrote: |
Besides 9W has lost them because they are not able to pay them... |
So I asked where you got that information from. How can you say Jet Airways can’t pay their management? _________________ eP007
Last edited by stealthpilot on Thu Apr 12, 2007 3:54 am; edited 1 time in total |
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victor2alpha Member
Joined: 08 Apr 2007 Posts: 120
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:13 pm Post subject: |
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BTW, wasn't the issue about centralisation of power in LON and some issues with Naresh and NOT really the pay? _________________ victor2alpha |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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stealthpilot wrote: | So I asked where you got that information from. How can you say Jet Airways can’t may their management? |
I was speaking wrt to IT _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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HAWK21M Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 8132 Location: Mumbai, INDIA
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 10:20 am Post subject: |
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the_380 wrote: | stealthpilot wrote: | Are you saying Jet Airways can’t pay their management…. so they left??
Where on earth did you get that idea from? |
Dude, IT pays the highest to its executives |
Are you sure
regds
MEL _________________ Think of the Brighter side !!! |
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VABBy Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 823 Location: DEL
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 11:29 am Post subject: |
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Mates another news for u. Current CEO of Jet Airways Mr. Wolfgang Prock-Schauer seems to be really unhappy abt his current position and is already planning to look for a change in job before is tenure expires becoz there is no descion making authority and responsiblity which has been delegated to him.
Its the NG who as a chairman and person who owns 80% of tailwinds which controls the Jet airways who continues to call shots in each and every descion making process. (HT MINT)
In the senior level management its never abt the money because anyways on top level the renumerations are gud its always abt the authority and power u command.
Sorrie mates cant post the link for the HT Mint article. But it carried a full two page article ie on front and back page abt the whole drama happeing in Jet. Though the ceo declined to comment officially . The ex head of inflight catering who had resigned recently and joined KF quoted that CEO is more of a dummy figure head. _________________ Expeditors- You'd be surprised how far we will go for you www.expeditors.com |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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HAWK21M wrote: |
Are you sure
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Yes as i've compared 7 posts in IT and 9W, IT people have more pays than 9W counterparts. Only one thing 9W boasts is the shares with its people.
VABBy wrote: | The ex head of inflight catering who had resigned recently and joined KF quoted that CEO is more of a dummy figure head. |
Then why did NG waste so much money behind him all this time ? _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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HAWK21M Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 8132 Location: Mumbai, INDIA
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="the_380"] HAWK21M wrote: |
Are you sure
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Yes as i've compared 7 posts in IT and 9W, IT people have more pays than 9W counterparts. Only one thing 9W boasts is the shares with its people.
Any details with breakup.
regds
MEL _________________ Think of the Brighter side !!! |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Thu Apr 12, 2007 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | Any details with breakup. |
Seriously no idea but so many top managers resigning at one shot means definately some reason. _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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VABBy Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 823 Location: DEL
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Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 9:25 am Post subject: |
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what nonesense u just quoted in ur previous post that u have compared 7 jobs in regards to pay packets in IT & 9W and Kingfisher seems to be paying more to its ppl. And when Mel asks for the details u say u dnt have any idea.
Then may i knw on wat basis ur quoting.. Plzzzzzzz provide concrete figures to support ur argument otherwise its just plain simple gossip and nothing else... _________________ Expeditors- You'd be surprised how far we will go for you www.expeditors.com |
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the_380 Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 2329 Location: Mumbai, India
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Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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VABBy wrote: | what nonesense u just quoted in ur previous post that u have compared 7 jobs in regards to pay packets in IT & 9W and Kingfisher seems to be paying more to its ppl. And when Mel asks for the details u say u dnt have any idea.
Then may i knw on wat basis ur quoting.. Plzzzzzzz provide concrete figures to support ur argument otherwise its just plain simple gossip and nothing else... |
Can you provide me with 'concrete figures' as to what S2 Board members get paid ?
CAn u provide 'concrete figures' on whatever u've said in tht other thread about S2- Emotionally Yours ?
Mel asked the details of the people RESIGNING ... and there is no compulsion that those people must have left because of payment reasons. It might be due to difference in opinion also. Might be these people did not want their airline to buy S2, they might have seen more losses than what they can earn from S2.
We don't even know if those people who left 9W have joined IT or not neither did i mention anything as such _________________ http://www.myspace.com/avsatsworld
A Walt Disney and 20th Century Fox Audio Producer!!! |
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VABBy Member
Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 823 Location: DEL
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Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 5:40 pm Post subject: |
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See Avijeet no personal offences against you nor i am intrested in personal head ons with you. Its really funny that i ask a question and i get a question....
beta i ws jst quoting wat all u said. C,mon we all know the 8 ppl who resigned. The names are right up there in thread U said u have done a comparison for employees or those 8 ppl who quit 9W and IT
Out of them 4 ppl were joining IT . U quoted that i have done a comparison.
Mel asks you for a break up to which u quote i dont knw...
If u dnt have the figures with you of the salaries being paid by 9W or IT hw have u been able to do a comparison...
As far as S2 is concerned i dnt bluff i always quote the sources which in 99.9% is the media
We are here for a qualitative discussion here not to listen stories and yes and no,s of ppl.....
I hope ur understanding what i am saying if some thread is under discussion and u have got something up your sleeve post it otherwise plzzz dont type . Just dont punch in for the heck of contribution...
Becoz honestly speaking its my personal view that if u dnt have those figures ur just bluffing and posting for the heck of it.......... _________________ Expeditors- You'd be surprised how far we will go for you www.expeditors.com |
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malQ Member
Joined: 20 Dec 2006 Posts: 713 Location: Delhi, India
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Posted: Fri Apr 13, 2007 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Could it be feasible that some of the departures from 9W also had something to do with the 9W-S2 episode? At the end of the day, within 9W, this has been brewing since mid-March'07, when NG first tried to re-establish contact with SR.
Also, very strong inputs that 9W is about to launch a paralel LCC operation, and very soon too.
May also be linked to induction of some key S2 personnel into 9W? |
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