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jasepl
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 Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 5:58 pm Post subject: Bal Thackeray dies |
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They finally confirmed officially what everyone knew : Bal Thackeray has died.
Not wanting to speak ill of the recently departed (at least not yet) all I'll say is that I, for one, shan't be mourning him.
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Nimish
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| Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2012 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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I hope the sainiks understand that bringing the city down with mindless violence is not the right way to honor their leader. Hopefully BOM will be left unscathed.
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iah87
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| Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:51 am Post subject: |
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So far so good. BOM appears to be calm and most of the supporters have had days of warning that Bal Thackerey may die.
Now the real tussle begins between his son and Raj Thackerey. |
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ssbmat
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| Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 8:04 am Post subject: |
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The tiger roars his last..Absolutely unique character in the Indian political landscape..
not always wrong in his thoughts, not always right in his deeds..
At a time when calling oneself a "staunch muslim" makes one a secular person and calling oneself a "staunch hindu" makes one a communal person (thanks to the ruling central party), he chose to be politically incorrect and called himself a staunch hindu, and was the only political figure who dared to say so. |
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justbala
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| Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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| ssbmat wrote: |
At a time when calling oneself a "staunch muslim" makes one a secular person and calling oneself a "staunch hindu" makes one a communal person .
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You can call yourself whatever you want... as long as you dont throw your religion, belief and practices on my face and force it upon others.
Never liked Thackeray n his ilk (for the same reason I dont like Nasar Madani) who believed that xenophobia rocks!! |
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Nimish
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| Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 12:36 pm Post subject: |
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| justbala wrote: | | You can call yourself whatever you want... as long as you dont throw your religion, belief and practices on my face and force it upon others. |
Luckily India still offers a peaceful haven for most people - and I hope it stays that way. More power to the peaceful and inclusive nature of Indians.
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G-BYGB
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| Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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I was just watching one of Bal Thackery's interview to Times Now, where he said that "there are only two type of castes which is Rich and the Poor in the world. The Poor should become Rich and the Rich should not become Poor."
That is so true and he is also right in saying that within a region, he/she should be loyal to their region but ones he/she is outside their region they should be an Indians first.
We still see lot of inter state rivalries and when it comes to the test of standing united as one nation, there is still a lot of question mark.
For whatever reason people may love to hate him, some of his point of views carry lot of meaning especially at the current scenerio.
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Jaysit
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:14 am Post subject: |
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Get ready for Bal Thackeray Navi Mumbai Airport, Bal Thackeray Hilton, Bal Thackeray Marg 1-999, Bal Thackeray Dreamliner, Bal Thackeray VIP Banyans, etc.
It's gonna make the Shivaji or bust crowd very, very confused.
Who do we honor? Shivaji and his mummy-ji, or Bal Thackeray? |
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Jeh
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:49 am Post subject: |
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| Jaysit wrote: | | Bal Thackeray Hilton |
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ssbmat
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:52 am Post subject: |
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| Nimish wrote: | | justbala wrote: | | You can call yourself whatever you want... as long as you dont throw your religion, belief and practices on my face and force it upon others. |
Luckily India still offers a peaceful haven for most people - and I hope it stays that way. More power to the peaceful and inclusive nature of Indians. |
"Inclusive nature" should not be used as an excuse by ruling political class to encourage illegal migration from across borders for vote bank politics or promote artists , entertainers and cricketers from neighbors who are otherwise hellbent on creating acts of violence..our ineffective government with a sheep of a Head of govt has no answers to this.
I wish India were a stronger and assertive country that welcomes good of everyone else but does not tolerate nonsense and deals firmly with internal and external disturbances. |
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himmat01
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:35 am Post subject: |
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I am surprised he was given a state funeral. Thank God, it was only the Mumbai Police and not the defense forces.
Almost the whole of Mumbai was closed yesterday more out of fear than respect. No business would like their property to be vandalized by the sainiks and the cops just mutely watching the tamasha.
I personally shed no tears for him and wish that with his departure, all these sundry senas disappear.
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jasepl
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 10:48 am Post subject: |
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| ssbmat wrote: | | "Inclusive nature" should not be used as an excuse by ruling political class to encourage illegal migration from across borders for vote bank politics or promote artists , entertainers and cricketers from neighbors who are otherwise hellbent on creating acts of violence. |
So I suppose it's perfectly good to be a goonda and to monger hate and inflict terror on people from within the country? So long as some noise is made about the Congress' supposed tactic of sneaking millions of Bangladeshis and Burmese and Martians into the country?
You sure you're not a shakha pramookh ?
| himmat01 wrote: | I am surprised he was given a state funeral. Thank God, it was only the Mumbai Police and not the defense forces.
Almost the whole of Mumbai was closed yesterday more out of fear than respect. No business would like their property to be vandalized by the sainiks and the cops just mutely watching the tamasha.
I personally shed no tears for him and wish that with his departure, all these sundry senas disappear. |
Amen, brother.Along with their disappearance, one can only hope that Mumbai turns into Bombay again (in spirit, not name). Unfortunately, I think too much damage has been done for our city to ever be the great place it once was.
As for things being closed, it's not just fear, never mind (dis) respect that kept things closed and quiet. I spoke to my kinda-sorta ex who lives in Juhu, and, apparently, the Sena goondas went from bungalow to bungalow and demanded that all the Diwali lights be switched off, or else... They didn't even spare the super rich in their super expensive bungalows of super rich Juhu, never mind all the bogus statements they made.
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ssbmat
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 11:43 am Post subject: |
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[quote="jasepl"] | ssbmat wrote: | | "Inclusive nature" should not be used as an excuse by ruling political class to encourage illegal migration from across borders for vote bank politics or promote artists , entertainers and cricketers from neighbors who are otherwise hellbent on creating acts of violence. |
So I suppose it's perfectly good to be a goonda and to monger hate and inflict terror on people from within the country? So long as some noise is made about the Congress' supposed tactic of sneaking millions of Bangladeshis and Burmese and Martians into the country?
You sure you're not a shakha pramookh ?
So in your opinion, its alright to have illegal immigrants from bangladesh set up shop in India, in large numbers, and also alright to have cricket matches and music contests and what-have-you, while our neighbours send people over to kill several dozens of innocent people?
Are you a Pradesh Cong Comittee member ?
There are several ppl in and out of this forum who would never accept these points, and one doesnt need to belong to any political outfit for that.. |
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jasepl
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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A couple of those may be genuine concerns, but making a bit of noise, writing a few articles and drawing a bunch of cartoons about them somehow absolves the murderous bunch of thugs of the decades of hatemongering and terrorism and blowing people up and dhamkis and general all-around goondaness?
I hate Gujaratis and Madrasis and Muslims and Bangladeshis and Biharis and Pakistanis and UP Wallahs and Malyalees and Kashmiris and Assamese and everyone who's not a native, faithful Hindu manoos - and you should hate them too and destroy their property and kill them if you can.
That is something to be admired and glorified? Really?
| Jaysit wrote: | Get ready for Bal Thackeray Navi Mumbai Airport, Bal Thackeray Hilton, Bal Thackeray Marg 1-999, Bal Thackeray Dreamliner, Bal Thackeray VIP Banyans, etc.
It's gonna make the Shivaji or bust crowd very, very confused.
Who do we honor? Shivaji and his mummy-ji, or Bal Thackeray? |
Hehehe ! But isn't one supposed to be the latter-day reincarnation of the other? So honouring either would automatically mean the other is honoured, right? 
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justbala
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Jeh
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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| jasepl wrote: | A couple of those may be genuine concerns, but making a bit of noise, writing a few articles and drawing a bunch of cartoons about them somehow absolves the murderous bunch of thugs of the decades of hatemongering and terrorism and blowing people up and dhamkis and general all-around goondaness?
I hate Gujaratis and Madrasis and Muslims and Bangladeshis and Biharis and Pakistanis and UP Wallahs and Malyalees and Kashmiris and Assamese and everyone who's not a native, faithful Hindu manoos - and you should hate them too and destroy their property and kill them if you can.
That is something to be admired and glorified? Really?
| Jaysit wrote: | Get ready for Bal Thackeray Navi Mumbai Airport, Bal Thackeray Hilton, Bal Thackeray Marg 1-999, Bal Thackeray Dreamliner, Bal Thackeray VIP Banyans, etc.
It's gonna make the Shivaji or bust crowd very, very confused.
Who do we honor? Shivaji and his mummy-ji, or Bal Thackeray? |
Hehehe ! But isn't one supposed to be the latter-day reincarnation of the other? So honouring either would automatically mean the other is honoured, right? |
But seriously, what are the odds of Balasaheb Thackeray International Airport popping up in Navi Mumbai in 2063 or whenever it's supposed to be ready? I was quite alarmed by the popular turnout for Thackeray's funeral and the almost blanket-saintly coverage of it.
Mind you, naming a Mumbai airport after Thackeray would be like renaming JFK the Khaled Sheikh Mohammed Memorial Airport.  |
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The_Goat
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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| iah87 wrote: |
Now the real tussle begins between his son and Raj Thackerey. |
Bal Thackeray's son Uddhav stands no chance , IMO. Raj is way too crafty , and also has huge popular support. Uddhav was pretty much relying on Bal Thackeray for everything.
The Shiv Sena is now finished. Their voters will move to Raj Thackeray en masse.
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Jaysit
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| Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2012 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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OK, his ashes have cooled.
Have at it.
Let's call that SOB what he was - a fascist thug and a coward who preyed on the weak and the innocent while amassing a fortune for himself and his passel of cowardly family members. This so-called "tiger" only roared behind the safety of his 200 (state paid) guards.
What kind of ignorant buffoon openly proclaims his love for Adolf Hitler? Well, the Bal Thackeray kind. Who would proudly show visiting western journalists the toilet bowl in which Michael Jackson took a dump when visiting Thackeray? Again, this buffoonish character.
And so damned what if 2 million - or for that matter 200 million - showed up at his funeral? The equally thuggish Ayatollah Khomeini attracted even larger numbers. Fascists - unless they've been discredited during their lives (Hitler, Mussolini) continue to wield that power over the faithful. It doesn't make them any less reprehensible. |
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iah87
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himmat01
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| Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:34 am Post subject: |
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| iah87 wrote: | http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/two-women-arrested-for-facebook-post-on-mumbai-shutdown-294239
Just when I thought that funeral was going without any incident this happens. Shiv sena takes one step forward and two steps backward. It is incidents like these make them unpopular. Not only these women were arrested, Shiv sainiks ransacked one of the woman's uncle's clinic. |
It's a shame. What else can you expect from the sena goons and there are people who justify this kind of behavior.
In Pakistan, it was the Taliban who who shot Malala but in India it is the cops who arrest her instead of providing her security from the sena goons.
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Jaysit
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| Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:48 pm Post subject: |
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| himmat01 wrote: | | iah87 wrote: | http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/two-women-arrested-for-facebook-post-on-mumbai-shutdown-294239
Just when I thought that funeral was going without any incident this happens. Shiv sena takes one step forward and two steps backward. It is incidents like these make them unpopular. Not only these women were arrested, Shiv sainiks ransacked one of the woman's uncle's clinic. |
It's a shame. What else can you expect from the sena goons and there are people who justify this kind of behavior.
In Pakistan, it was the Taliban who who shot Malala but in India it is the cops who arrest her instead of providing her security from the sena goons. |
Courtesy Thackeray, the cops and the Sena goons are often one and the same. |
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The_Goat
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| Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaysit wrote: |
Fascists - unless they've been discredited during their lives (Hitler, Mussolini) continue to wield that power over the faithful. It doesn't make them any less reprehensible. |
Even the ones who have been discredited during their lives have followers. Hitler is still worshipped by many all over the world. In fact, his Mein Kampf is still a bestseller in ...... India, of all places!
These people play on the insecurities of the common folk and present themselves as messaiahs without whom everyone's worst fears would come true! Hitler did that in Germany against the Jews, Idi Amin in Uganda against the Asians and Bal Thackeray in Mumbai against everyone who wasn't a Maharashtrian.
Unfortunately, with everybody's insecurity with everything only increasing every day, we will see more such nutcases.
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ssbmat
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:16 am Post subject: |
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| The_Goat wrote: | | Jaysit wrote: |
Fascists - unless they've been discredited during their lives (Hitler, Mussolini) continue to wield that power over the faithful. It doesn't make them any less reprehensible. |
Even the ones who have been discredited during their lives have followers. Hitler is still worshipped by many all over the world. In fact, his Mein Kampf is still a bestseller in ...... India, of all places!
These people play on the insecurities of the common folk and present themselves as messaiahs without whom everyone's worst fears would come true! Hitler did that in Germany against the Jews, Idi Amin in Uganda against the Asians and Bal Thackeray in Mumbai against everyone who wasn't a Maharashtrian.
Unfortunately, with everybody's insecurity with everything only increasing every day, we will see more such nutcases. |
Some perspective, please..agree that most of his public posturing was buffoonish..but to equate it with a state sponsored regime of terror , mass killing and repression ala Idi Amin and Hitler is way out of line..by that token, Cong govt of 1984 (sikh riots) and Guj Govt of 2002 are much bigger culprits.
I completely agree with his views on not entertaining pakistan in any way until outstanding issues are resolved..Even the beloved nation of this forum, USA does not deal with Iran (although there is NO direct conflict between them really speaking) |
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jasepl
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| The_Goat wrote: | | Bal Thackeray in Mumbai against everyone who wasn't a Maharashtrian. |
Not quite. I am very much a Maharashtrian. As are, for example, Tina Munim and Faran Akthar.
And if one really wants to nitpick, the three examples cited above are more Bombayites than Bal Terrorist could ever be, given how we were all born in this city, and he, well, wasn't. He was a dirty migrant too, just like the ones he despised.
So yeah, it's not against Maharashtrians. It's against pretty much everyone who's non-Hindu and non-manoos. And, I suppose, even if you are a Hindu manoos, if you're not one of the blind faithful, then off with your head (and your shop, as well as your uncle's) too.
| ssbmat wrote: | | Some perspective, please..agree that most of his public posturing was buffoonish..but to equate it with a state sponsored regime of terror , mass killing and repression ala Idi Amin and Hitler is way out of line..by that token, Cong govt of 1984 (sikh riots) and Guj Govt of 2002 are much bigger culprits. |
And what the Sena did (and continues to do) wasn't state-sponsored? What was it then? A garden tea party? And just because someone else did something, makes it perfectly okay for the Marathi terrorists to do it?
Those others at least had some balls, including the reprehensible Modi. Bal-T, on the other hand, made all kinds of nioses from behind a cartoon, but never took on the responsibility that comes with elected office.
That said, it's tragic when someone is so blinded by someone else's (flawed) cause.
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Jeh
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| Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:36 pm Post subject: |
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| jasepl wrote: | | And, I suppose, even if you are a Hindu manoos, if you're not one of the blind faithful, then off with your head (and your shop, as well as your uncle's) too. |
I'm what you'd call one of the 'manoos', and nominally Hindu to boot. I can assure you I considered the man an absolute swine, as did absolutely everyone else I know, and am confident he would've had no compunctions setting his nutcase supporters on me had I made a public statement or action that offended him. And practically everything offended him - he once set his supporters on the offices of the Marathi channel IBN Lokmat because their Editor (Nikhil Wagle, a thorn in the Shiv Sena's side and a 'manoos' with balls and integrity) called him 'an old man' during a broadcast. Thackeray was 83 at the time.
The old fart and his supporters did nothing for either the Marathi people, culture or language other than randomly assaulting whichever innocent group suited his political ambitions, on the pretext of their being a threat to the Marathi/Hindu 'cause'. I belong to the ethnic community Thackeray claimed to represent, and I can tell you this much - no single person or institution has done as much damage to the good name of the 'Marathi' people, as Bal Thackeray and his Shiv Sena. And, as with Indira Gandhi, his gleeful undermining of our essential institutions and installation of a neurotic cult of dynastic hero-worship is something that will cost us dearly for a long time to come.
Good riddance, I say. |
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Jeh
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avbuff
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| Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 10:25 am Post subject: |
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Lack of law and order/implementation of policies --> extra constitutional measures supported by masses when it suits their thought proces --> Local 'heroes' emerge --> Society gets polarised.
Unfortunately the root cause of such issues is governance. |
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Jeh
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jasepl
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| Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:15 am Post subject: |
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| Jeh wrote: | | My word, his legacy's alive and kicking. |
Well, just because Osama was killed, didn't mean the Taliban ceased to exist, did it?
| Jaysit wrote: | Get ready for Bal Thackeray Navi Mumbai Airport, Bal Thackeray Hilton, Bal Thackeray Marg 1-999, Bal Thackeray Dreamliner, Bal Thackeray VIP Banyans, etc.
It's gonna make the Shivaji or bust crowd very, very confused.
Who do we honor? Shivaji and his mummy-ji, or Bal Thackeray? |
Careful what you wish for Jay:
- Bombay-Goa highway
- Churgate Station
- New airport
- Dadar station
Plus
- Memorial
- International museum (whatever that means)
- Busts and idols
- Textbooks
- Elocution competitions in state schools (WTF does that mean?)
- Another museum, spread over twelve acres, no less
http://www.ndtv.com/article/cities/demand-to-rename-mumbai-spots-after-shiv-sena-patriarch-bal-thackeray-296051?pfrom=home-cities
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Jaysit
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:30 am Post subject: |
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The best way to celebrate both his "legacy" while providing much needed services to the city's poor (and not-so-poor) is to build thousands of clean, well-maintained, and accessible public toilets in his memory.
While you're at it, put the chaddi-wearing, lathi-wielding Shiv Sainiks in charge of fining those who instead of celebrating the Great One by using one of the newly built clean loos dedicated to Him, choose to use the pavements instead.
Add to it a few sewage treatment plants, a fleet of garbage pick-up trucks and you'll see even the poshest Parsee socialite in the poshest neighborhood sing the praises of the dearly departed - in Marathi. |
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The_Goat
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Jaysit wrote: | The best way to celebrate both his "legacy" while providing much needed services to the city's poor (and not-so-poor) is to build thousands of clean, well-maintained, and accessible public toilets in his memory.
While you're at it, put the chaddi-wearing, lathi-wielding Shiv Sainiks in charge of fining those who instead of celebrating the Great One by using one of the newly built clean loos dedicated to Him, choose to use the pavements instead.
Add to it a few sewage treatment plants, a fleet of garbage pick-up trucks and you'll see even the poshest Parsee socialite in the poshest neighborhood sing the praises of the dearly departed - in Marathi. |
If our politicos had such a mindset, even half of it, we would not only not have the phenomenon called the 'NRI', but will also have have droves of Swiss, Finns, Norwegians and other first-world white folk moving to India " for a better life".
Ain't happening in my lifetime.
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jasepl
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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Instead, we may have a big part of one of our very few open public spaces converted into a permanent memorial.
Because, you know, Shivaji Park is now holier than Ayodhya, evidently.
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Jaysit
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| Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 9:44 pm Post subject: |
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| jasepl wrote: | Instead, we may have a big part of one of our very few open public spaces converted into a permanent memorial.
Because, you know, Shivaji Park is now holier than Ayodhya, evidently. |
Won't stop some manoos (or non-manoos) from taking a piss in it though.
I remember walking past it a few years ago and it smelled like one giant latrine. |
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Spiderguy252
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| Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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A belated RIP, but good riddance at the same time. The guy incited nothing but hate. Hate against Muslims, hate against non-Maharashtrians, hate against Pakistanis. Let him go to hell, literally as it were.
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jasepl
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| Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Spiderguy252 wrote: | | A belated RIP, but good riddance at the same time. The guy incited nothing but hate. Hate against Muslims, hate against non-Maharashtrians, hate against Pakistanis. Let him go to hell, literally as it were. |
Amen brother!
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