Airliners-India.com Flickr Group & Facebook    FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in  9W stopping ATQ - LHR and IT extends BLR - LHR to SFO Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next          Airliners-India.com Forum Index -> Civil Aviation View previous topic :: View next topic   Author Message flightgearpilot Member Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 711 Location: VOBL Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:52 pm    Post subject: haree wrote: I would differ with that point. KF Girls do carry an inherent attitude not found in most other airlines and the smiles arent quite as evident as you said. Some of my best flying experiences have been with IT. And it's got nothing to do with their choice of colours or interior decoration. Of all the airlines I have flown, IT FAs have been the most polite and don't have a schoolteacher-admonishing-schoolkid kind of stare that I find so common among several international carriers be they LH or Delta or NW. Back to top dishasamtani Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 72 Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:54 pm    Post subject: jasepl wrote: vivekman wrote: I think they are a nice bunch of girls, dressed in some garishly loud, attention drawing uniforms. I feel VJM should have selected a more sober colour for their uniforms.- Vivek Oh totally. The uniforms, interiors, everything... All so <i>jhatak</i> and crass. But its the attention whore Mallya in charge after all, so classless and tasteless are par for the course. I would like to put forward my points here. Red is a pretty common color among airlines. Virgin Atlantic, Cathay Pacific(?), Spicejet, Air Asia, Kenya Airways are few examples. But I'm not getting the point why Kingfisher is termed as whorehouses. Back to top sammyk Member Joined: 20 Dec 2006 Posts: 2719 Location: Austin, TX Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:05 pm    Post subject: dishasamtani wrote: jasepl wrote: vivekman wrote: I think they are a nice bunch of girls, dressed in some garishly loud, attention drawing uniforms. I feel VJM should have selected a more sober colour for their uniforms.- Vivek Oh totally. The uniforms, interiors, everything... All so <i>jhatak</i> and crass. But its the attention whore Mallya in charge after all, so classless and tasteless are par for the course. I would like to put forward my points here. Red is a pretty common color among airlines. Virgin Atlantic, Cathay Pacific(?), Spicejet, Air Asia, Kenya Airways are few examples. But I'm not getting the point why Kingfisher is termed as whorehouses. Could be because it is red on red on red. Virgin is probably the airline that VJM modeled Kingfisher on so he'd probably make the same comment with that airline. Cathay interiors are blue/green. Actually there is not much red involved with this airline outside of their flag as far as I know. Kenya red/blue Spicejet blue Air Asia blue/black Back to top dishasamtani Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 72 Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:09 pm    Post subject: I was talking about uniforms. Interiors are different for the above mentioned airlines. Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:17 pm    Post subject: The uniforms aren't bad, the IT girls are wonderful, and the airline is perhaps the best short haul carrier in the skies today. But red on red on red is a bit much on the eyes. If he'd kept a more neutral color in the cabins with red trim and red embellishments, it would have given the AC a sharper look. AI's new 777 cabins too have a lot of red, but the AI cabins are beautiful, whereas IT's cabins are just a bit too much. Of course, this is all just a question of personal taste. Not very objective. Back to top sammyk Member Joined: 20 Dec 2006 Posts: 2719 Location: Austin, TX Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:37 pm    Post subject: dishasamtani wrote: I was talking about uniforms. Interiors are different for the above mentioned airlines. Ah, sorry. Well, he wasn't referring to the FAs as whores, just the overuse of red. Back to top jasepl Member Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 4257 Location: bund-bay Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:47 am    Post subject: dishasamtani wrote: I would like to put forward my points here. Red is a pretty common color among airlines. Virgin Atlantic, Cathay Pacific(?), Spicejet, Air Asia, Kenya Airways are few examples. But I'm not getting the point why Kingfisher is termed as whorehouses. Using red is one thing. But take the amount and shade of red used, couple that with Mallya's bling, unbuttoned shirt with nasty chest hair spilling out, and add his penchant for no-longer-funny slapstick innuendo. Back to top ryder1650 Member Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 554 Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 2:26 am    Post subject: So have we heard anything concrete on this from the IT and 9W camps? Or is this all from that one article? Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 3:51 am    Post subject: Jaysit wrote: The uniforms aren't bad, the IT girls are wonderful, and the airline is perhaps the best short haul carrier in the skies today. Thanks for those words. You are one of the few people who understand how stressful our jobs are where a smile can make or break things. Most of the men traveling with us are perverts. It is very difficult to deal with their tantrums, obscene visual and physical gestures; and that too with a smile. You folks deal with rude FA's once a while, we deal with nasty passengers everyday. Back to top sshank Member Joined: 16 May 2007 Posts: 377 Location: NYC Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 6:32 am    Post subject: Neha - welcome to a.net. I too have had nothing but positive experience when travelling by IT (and what a refreshing change from the US carriers and the surly FAs who are "here primarily for our safety"). I realize being a FA is a hard job - its not easy to be enthusiastic and charming all the time. However, aren't you getting a little carried away when you call most Indian men perverts? Surely, its not that bad, or is it? neha_skies wrote: Jaysit wrote: The uniforms aren't bad, the IT girls are wonderful, and the airline is perhaps the best short haul carrier in the skies today. Thanks for those words. You are one of the few people who understand how stressful our jobs are where a smile can make or break things. Most of the men traveling with us are perverts. It is very difficult to deal with their tantrums, obscene visual and physical gestures; and that too with a smile. You folks deal with rude FA's once a while, we deal with nasty passengers everyday. Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Thank you sshank, I stand by my comment. Other than our flights between and BOM and DEL and maybe Goa, each and every flight is a terror for us. The briefing we receive, the checkings and all other protocols to which we must abide is very terrorizing.Then the passengers scare us with their abnormal behaviours and gestures. The Indian men especially the 30+ age group champion at these silly acts. It is not easy to walk by and serve them with a smile. We do feel uncomfortable. The worst is the evening and night flights where at many occasions we have drunk people on board ( who drank maybe at the airport or the bar nearby). These things on a daily basis is too much 20 21 year old FAs. Live my life for a month and maybe you will then may know what it is being an FA and that too with Kingfisher. Back to top flightgearpilot Member Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 711 Location: VOBL Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:41 pm    Post subject: Hi Neha, Welcome to A-I.net. I completely empathize with your words. In my little flying experience, IT FAs have been the most professional. I remember once in GOI when there was a passenger at the check-in counter talking very crudely. I was standing behind him and was getting irritated myself, but the lady at the desk handled the situation superbly. Later on I wrote an appreciation mail on IT's website. Don't know whether it reached anybody though. If it is any consolation, let me also state that every profession has its professional hazards. In my case, after teaching for 8 years, I am practically at my wits' ends. (That is perhaps the reason why I visit this site -- to speak about aviation and get my mind off the %$@% at work). What pains me most is when students pass value judgments very casually upon their teachers like, "He is an egoist", "He is no good", etc. without knowing what they are speaking. I know they don't mean any harm, but it hurts nevertheless. Especially if the teacher has had disagreements with colleagues and such statements are used to fan flames. Anyway, I just thought I'd post this.. Maybe because misery loves company? So, don't bother about what people say.. keep up the good work! Back to top iflytb20 Member Joined: 27 Jan 2007 Posts: 1079 Location: Next to the Airport Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 5:33 pm    Post subject: neha_skies wrote: The worst is the evening and night flights where at many occasions we have drunk people on board ( who drank maybe at the airport or the bar nearby). These things on a daily basis is too much 20 21 year old FAs. Try flying our sectors once in a while. You will get 100 or so drunk 30+ guys on a daily basis who feel that creating a scene is a way of moving forward in life. Almost every other flight has the IFS reporting to the capt with " Captain we have a small prob back here". The only saving grace is that booze is not free on our planes. And that makes you appreciate the AI crew ever more. After all, booze is free there. I feel all crew should be given pepper spray. But on second thoughts, i think not. There will be as many pilots sprayed as misbehaving pax Back to top AKLDELNonstop Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1066 Location: Auckland Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 6:05 am    Post subject: neha_skies wrote: Most of the men traveling with us are perverts. It is very difficult to deal with their tantrums, obscene visual and physical gestures; and that too with a smile. You folks deal with rude FA's once a while, we deal with nasty passengers everyday. Most of the IT FAs are whores working for the pimp daddy VM. Didn't like that? Then don't make statements like the one you did. Not only is it plain silly, but also exposes your lack of cranial matter. I was told by many that IT FAs are all wannabe models with bling, coupled with a distinct lack of sophistication or grace. Didnt believe it at first, but your words leave me with few doubts. _________________ Geniuses are always misunderstood in their lifetimes. Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:01 am    Post subject: AKLDELNonstop wrote: neha_skies wrote: Most of the men traveling with us are perverts. It is very difficult to deal with their tantrums, obscene visual and physical gestures; and that too with a smile. You folks deal with rude FA's once a while, we deal with nasty passengers everyday. Most of the IT FAs are whores working for the pimp daddy VM. Didn't like that? Then don't make statements like the one you did. Not only is it plain silly, but also exposes your lack of cranial matter. I was told by many that IT FAs are all wannabe models with bling, coupled with a distinct lack of sophistication or grace. Didnt believe it at first, but your words leave me with few doubts. Seriously, did your Mama not teach you any manners? And here I thought that the Kiwi culture was all about wit and grace and good manners. This young woman is giving us an analysis based on her real life work experiences. And while you may be offended by what may appear to be a broad indictment of a large number of male passengers, you could at least have asked her to qualify her comments. All that you're doing is trotting off second hand comments made by your "many" sources, people who apparently are guiltiest in the lacking sophistication and/or grace department. Apparently, you've never flown IT or else you wouldn't be making comments like the one you just did. Their cabin crew are immaculate even in 100 degree weather, at 5 AM or at midnight, and unlike models never act like divas even when having to deal with some pretty uncouth types. You owe a collective apology not only to her but also to all the young women who work very hard for IT. Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:16 am    Post subject: AKLDELNonstop wrote: Most of the IT FAs are whores working for the pimp daddy VM. Didn't like that? Then don't make statements like the one you did. Not only is it plain silly, but also exposes your lack of cranial matter. I suppose you have a lot of cranial material overflowing and falling over your eyes. You ought to clean em up and then see the world. I don't get offended by such statements as we deal with your kinds daily. Your above baseless statements just validates my point. Dr, Mallya has nothing to do directly with our recruitment. AKLDELNonstop wrote: I was told by many that IT FAs are all wannabe models with bling, coupled with a distinct lack of sophistication or grace. Didnt believe it at first, but your words leave me with few doubts. I can bring up as many eye witnesses, registered Police cases and all other official stuff to back up my claim. I bet you a 1000 bucks you cant back any of your claims. Back to top AKLDELNonstop Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1066 Location: Auckland Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:10 pm    Post subject: Neha, Jay, See thats the whole point. Neha, my unqualified and false opinion made you react in that way. Thats exactly what I mean by not generalising. BTW I have flown IT back in the day, circa 2005/6. The point I'd make Neha is that you knew what you were getting in to. In a country like India, you would always get stares from people with your uniform. People in India apart from Metros, especially middle aged people who have never been abroad, have never seen girls in mini skirts. Most airlines have an option of uniforms i.e. skirt/trouser. IT markets itself as a bling bling airline. When you make a concious decision to work for such an airline, it wouldnt be right to complain about the same. It will just make you miserable. If you dont like something change it. _________________ Geniuses are always misunderstood in their lifetimes. Back to top karatecatman Guest Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:35 pm    Post subject: neha_skies wrote: Dr, Mallya has nothing to do directly with our recruitment. Doesn't he say, everytime he gets a sound byte, that he handpicks his crew! From a recent interview in Flight International Attention to detail It seems contradictory, then, that he is micromanaging Kingfisher Airlines so forcefully. He not only studies aircraft turnaround and load factor trends through text messages, he flies on his airline regularly to monitor service standards and is involved in virtually everything from the selection of staff uniforms to interviewing would-be employees. Particular attention is paid to flight attendant interviews, with Mallya insisting he needs to personally vet every future employee who will have contact with a “guest” to ensure strict quality control is maintained. *** It's just an honorary doctorate! So that makes him just (and still) Mr. Vijay Mallya. Back to top Punjabi Boy Member Joined: 31 Jan 2008 Posts: 219 Location: LONDON LHR Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:01 pm    Post subject: I am getting rather put off this site due to the use of such language....I thought we were ALL professionals here be we MX, Pilots or FAs.....First it was that Jasepl using such terms and now another. Please keep it clean and RESPECT ALL. Does not cost you anything. Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 5:18 pm    Post subject: AKLDELNonstop wrote: Neha, Jay, See thats the whole point. Neha, my unqualified and false opinion made you react in that way. Thats exactly what I mean by not generalising. BTW I have flown IT back in the day, circa 2005/6. The point I'd make Neha is that you knew what you were getting in to. In a country like India, you would always get stares from people with your uniform. People in India apart from Metros, especially middle aged people who have never been abroad, have never seen girls in mini skirts. Most airlines have an option of uniforms i.e. skirt/trouser. IT markets itself as a bling bling airline. When you make a concious decision to work for such an airline, it wouldnt be right to complain about the same. It will just make you miserable. If you dont like something change it. When you make a conscious decision to work for an airline in which the uniform is a skirt (its not a mini skirt), it doesn't mean you de facto cede your right to state your views to a sympathetic audience (as in A.net). Its not like these young women are refusing to serve these leches, or that, "Hema Malini ishtyle," they're busy maaroing thapads to these inflight Romeos, something I would applaud were I to witness it. Besides, anyone who's seen TV today, or any Bollywood flick has seen women in skirts - and far less. And even if they haven't, it doesn't make their lecherous behavior acceptable. By your yardstick, a woman with a beautiful body who shows it off in a revealing sari (instead of the roly poly auntie types who throw their saris on with a pitchfork), shouldn't complain if some goondas decide to sexually assault her. Instead of insulting these FAs, the least you can do is to listen to their depiction of reality. They're not asking for much - just a sympathetic ear. And that is not that hard to give. Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 6:18 pm    Post subject: karatecatman wrote: neha_skies wrote: Dr, Mallya has nothing to do directly with our recruitment. Doesn't he say, everytime he gets a sound byte, that he handpicks his crew! From a recent interview in Flight International Attention to detail It seems contradictory, then, that he is micromanaging Kingfisher Airlines so forcefully. He not only studies aircraft turnaround and load factor trends through text messages, he flies on his airline regularly to monitor service standards and is involved in virtually everything from the selection of staff uniforms to interviewing would-be employees. Particular attention is paid to flight attendant interviews, with Mallya insisting he needs to personally vet every future employee who will have contact with a “guest” to ensure strict quality control is maintained. *** It's just an honorary doctorate! So that makes him just (and still) Mr. Vijay Mallya. I am sorry, I did not know the honorary doctorate stuff. He handpicks them most of the time, but with recruitments happening now and then it is not possible for him to be there everytime. Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 6:40 pm    Post subject: AKLDELNonstop, Your responses cement my beliefs. Jaysit has nicely described my point of view. Thats all what I have to say. Back to top tayaramecanici Member Joined: 03 Jan 2007 Posts: 648 Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 6:49 pm    Post subject: Jasepl, The politicaly correct term for flashy RED UPHOLSTERY is ' BROTHEL CHIC', its a far more civilised term and regularly used by Automobile correspondents while describing the interiors of Lamborghinis and Bugattis - pimpmobile - incase you want to know the street name for these cruisers. neha_skies, Welcome to AI.net, its high time this website had a bit of VANITY. Now back to the slugfest. Back to top rhumbline Member Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 443 Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:06 pm    Post subject: Hey I don't want to incite any slugfests here ... but based on my around 15 flights on IT the service is highly variable and far from a standard product as everyone is making it out to be 9W is better as far as consistency in service standards are concerned. And there is some truth in AKLDEL's statements; a lot of the IT FAs do act like prima donnas who are just there to make a quick buck and move on to some thing else ... and what about the regular stories of late night carousing with the crew no one can deny that it happens _________________ Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival Back to top G-BYGB Member Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 1813 Location: Bangalore/Delhi Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:09 pm    Post subject: Hi Neha,welcome to AI.net! It is good to see more female members joining this site and giving their knowledge about airline industry. About controlling the behaviour of some pax who are drunk,don't you think having a male flight attendent along with you will make you feel safe? If he can flex his muscles,I'am sure the pax will sit quitely till they arrive at their destination.And the pax can't complain about the service coz he misbehaved.In other words it was his fault. _________________ www.flickr.com/G-BYGB photos Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:15 pm    Post subject: edited Last edited by neha_skies on Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:20 pm; edited 1 time in total Back to top G-BYGB Member Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 1813 Location: Bangalore/Delhi Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:17 pm    Post subject: Neha, do you prefer wearing saree as your uniform?Do you feel that will make pax enjoy flying rather than staring at you? _________________ www.flickr.com/G-BYGB photos Back to top G-BYGB Member Joined: 21 Dec 2006 Posts: 1813 Location: Bangalore/Delhi Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:25 pm    Post subject: Neha, if you feel offended by any of my posts,then I'am sorry. _________________ www.flickr.com/G-BYGB photos Back to top neha_skies Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 16 Location: Mumbai Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:27 pm    Post subject: G-BYGB wrote: Neha, if you feel offended by any of my posts,then I'am sorry. no not at all, please do not feel bad. Back to top jasepl Member Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 4257 Location: bund-bay Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 2:16 am    Post subject: Punjabi Boy wrote: I am getting rather put off this site due to the use of such language....I thought we were ALL professionals here be we MX, Pilots or FAs.....First it was that Jasepl using such terms and now another. Please keep it clean and RESPECT ALL. Does not cost you anything. Oh boo effing hoo... Cry me an effing river. And mind the door. Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 4:25 am    Post subject: rhumbline wrote: And there is some truth in AKLDEL's statements; a lot of the IT FAs do act like prima donnas who are just there to make a quick buck and move on to some thing else ... and what about the regular stories of late night carousing with the crew no one can deny that it happens Your comments are absurd. What would you want them to do besides "making a quick buck?" Stick around the airline till they're 65? Perform pujas before each take off? And besides, how does one make a quick buck at an airline? You get a standardized salary. Its not Wall Street. And what does one's personal late night carousing (or any carousing for that matter) have to do with the lecherous and unwanted behavior of male passengers? One can do whatever one chooses to do on one's own free time, as long as you show up to work and behave in a professional manner. Are you suggesting that just because some of the crew like to party during their free time, they're deserving of abuse while at their jobs? Back to top avbuff Member Joined: 22 Dec 2006 Posts: 5031 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:03 am    Post subject: Jaysit wrote: rhumbline wrote: And there is some truth in AKLDEL's statements; a lot of the IT FAs do act like prima donnas who are just there to make a quick buck and move on to some thing else ... and what about the regular stories of late night carousing with the crew no one can deny that it happens Your comments are absurd. What would you want them to do besides "making a quick buck?" Stick around the airline till they're 65? Perform pujas before each take off? And besides, how does one make a quick buck at an airline? You get a standardized salary. Its not Wall Street. And what does one's personal late night carousing (or any carousing for that matter) have to do with the lecherous and unwanted behavior of male passengers? One can do whatever one chooses to do on one's own free time, as long as you show up to work and behave in a professional manner. Are you suggesting that just because some of the crew like to party during their free time, they're deserving of abuse while at their jobs? Much as we ignore this issue, it is a reality today at workplace. Be it airlines, fashion, movies, IT companies. The trend of trading promotions with sexual favors does happen around us, but it is something that not everyone is aware of. Kingfisher is an easy target, Mallya handpicks his crew doesn't mean he sleeps with them. It is just that most of the crew are selected in his supervision. The midnight carousals are famous among the staff of every airline, but technically that is none of our business. But here is the hard fact. The Captains, FO at many places force these FAs to sleep with them else they threaten to put a negative remark on the FAs performance ( this fact can be challenged as it is just a story of hearsay). So even here the FA's are as good as exploited by the Flight deck crew. Not that every Captain does that, but it is very common. Whatever is the case Kingfisher FA'son all my flights have been at the top of their performance, performing their duties well. I also say some of them are very beautiful. I think the issue of "casting couch" is predominant everywhere, and Kingfisher should not be a target unnecessarily. Back to top Punjabi Boy Member Joined: 31 Jan 2008 Posts: 219 Location: LONDON LHR Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:38 am    Post subject: jasepl wrote: Punjabi Boy wrote: I am getting rather put off this site due to the use of such language....I thought we were ALL professionals here be we MX, Pilots or FAs.....First it was that Jasepl using such terms and now another. Please keep it clean and RESPECT ALL. Does not cost you anything. Oh boo effing hoo... Cry me an effing river. And mind the door. Carry on carry on....lower yourself into the heap....do carry on...show all your manners Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:44 am    Post subject: In a society like India where women's rights groups abound in metro areas, charges of sexual exploitation by a flight attendant against flight deck crew would cause a real tamasha. The victim, so to speak, would end up with a hefty legal award. The last thing that Mallya would want is for a bunch of jholewaali activist types to ruin his operations at Mumbai or Delhi. While I'm sure that KF's operations, like that of any entity anywhere has cases of sexual exploitation, its still no grounds for a passenger in Seat 23C to paw or leer at the working FAs. Back to top rhumbline Member Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 443 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:05 pm    Post subject: Jaysit wrote: rhumbline wrote: And there is some truth in AKLDEL's statements; a lot of the IT FAs do act like prima donnas who are just there to make a quick buck and move on to some thing else ... and what about the regular stories of late night carousing with the crew no one can deny that it happens Your comments are absurd. What would you want them to do besides "making a quick buck?" Stick around the airline till they're 65? Perform pujas before each take off? And besides, how does one make a quick buck at an airline? You get a standardized salary. Its not Wall Street. Quick buck in the sense that they are not there with any sort of commitment to the airline or to uphold its service standards. As far as jobs are concerned most of these FAs are just school passouts who won't be able to get jobs anywhere besides being an FA when it comes down to it. Jaysit wrote: And what does one's personal late night carousing (or any carousing for that matter) have to do with the lecherous and unwanted behavior of male passengers? One can do whatever one chooses to do on one's own free time, as long as you show up to work and behave in a professional manner. Are you suggesting that just because some of the crew like to party during their free time, they're deserving of abuse while at their jobs? No one making that kind of extension here but the point here is many times the FAs themselves flirt with passengers and IT does pride itself in attracting a certain 'kind' of clientele through its branding and advertising. Look at the famous Yana Gupta ads et al so I guess you reap what you sow and if the FAs are not trained to deal with it then bo hoo hoo to them. There are lecherous males everywhere in the service industry more so in hospitality and women there behave much more professionally than an average IT FA so I rather think it is a lack of training and immaturity on the FAs part. _________________ Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival Back to top AKLDELNonstop Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 1066 Location: Auckland Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:59 pm    Post subject: Firstly, Jay, I have no issues with whatever a girl wears. None whatsoever. Secondly, Rhumbline, I agree with you. I wasn't articulating myself well enough I guess. There are lots of airlines where th uniform is a skirt, BUT, there is a marked difference in the demeanour of the FAs (in say SQ than in IT). It did appear to me that IT FAs were more chosen on looks than service-oriented skills. Frankly, there is nothing more off-putting than an FA trying to be snooty, because she thinks she is pretty. I have seen this first hand and to say that it's comical would be modesty. When I travel in an airline, I do not care how pretty the airhostess are or what they are wearing. My concern is with service. Not overboard service, but just politeness and professionalism. This I think lacks in the aforementioned airline. For professionalism and service, I point you to the likes of SQ, 9W etc and for genuine warmth and friendliness, TG and NZ. To reiterate, Neha and Jay, I do not care what those girls look like or what they do in their own personal time. But when I am a paying customer I expect professionalism. And the fact that a representative of the airline generalises and calls me pervert, is reason enough not to patronise them anymore. Comprende??? _________________ Geniuses are always misunderstood in their lifetimes. Back to top dishasamtani Member Joined: 17 Oct 2008 Posts: 72 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:28 pm    Post subject: rhumbline wrote: No one making that kind of extension here but the point here is many times the FAs themselves flirt with passengers and IT does pride itself in attracting a certain 'kind' of clientele through its branding and advertising. Sour grapes. Maybe you are not worthy of any sort of flirting and that must have compelled you to make such comments. AKLDELNonstop, I request you personally not to use "whores" to describe any woman. Even a whore is not choosing a profession out of choice, circumstances force her. If it were a male FA flirting with a female passenger we don't call them gigolos or any other unpleasant terms. Your comments were a retaliation, I understand. Kingfisher Flight Staff are as professional as any other mainstream airline. I travel Kingfisher at least 2-3 times a month and I can vouch for that. Jaysit wrote: In a society like India where women's rights groups abound in metro areas, charges of sexual exploitation by a flight attendant against flight deck crew would cause a real tamasha. The victim, so to speak, would end up with a hefty legal award. The last thing that Mallya would want is for a bunch of jholewaali activist types to ruin his operations at Mumbai or Delhi. I do not know to laugh or cry at your naiive statements. The women's rights groups are actual Tamasha. Do you think a person like Mallya will even bother about such groups? Money speaks my friend. I will tell you something about "law". It is a set of guidelines put forward in the constitution where every citizen tries his best not to follow. This is how it is defined in India. You need to go more indepth in the working environment in India, you will know how ugly it can be at times. What you see in the news is just a case highlighted because of some presence of high profile personnel. Otherwise 90% of cases are suppressed. If I'm wrong I will quit eating Seyal Phulko and Sai Bhaji for the rest of my life. Back to top Jaysit Member Joined: 19 Dec 2006 Posts: 4346 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:02 pm    Post subject: rhumbline wrote: Quick buck in the sense that they are not there with any sort of commitment to the airline or to uphold its service standards. As far as jobs are concerned most of these FAs are just school passouts who won't be able to get jobs anywhere besides being an FA when it comes down to it. Your comment would pass the laugh test only if Kingfisher's service standards were in the toilet. But their service standards are among the industry's highest. And much of that acclaim comes from the inflight service provided by its cabin crew. Plus, given their impeccable English skills (a quality that is often missing on such stalwarts as SQ, CX and TG), IT has a singular advantage over such larger, more established Asian mega-carriers. Finally, as I've said before, the skills FAs bring to the table make or break a flight. They may not be able to sequence the human genome, but that isn't why they're there. They're part of the service industry, and good service in any endeavor is a highly skilled soft art upon which companies make or break their reputations. Don't knock it. Back to top rhumbline Member Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 443 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:26 pm    Post subject: dishasamtani wrote: rhumbline wrote: No one making that kind of extension here but the point here is many times the FAs themselves flirt with passengers and IT does pride itself in attracting a certain 'kind' of clientele through its branding and advertising. Sour grapes. Maybe you are not worthy of any sort of flirting and that must have compelled you to make such comments. Woah there don't know about you but I travel to go from point A to point B in relative comfort and not to make passes at FAs or vice versa. If I pay for my seat I expect certain service standards is that too much to expect. Through your comments you seem like another one of those bra burning feminists that tries to make every issue into an us versus them kind of scenario _________________ Learning is not compulsory. Neither is survival Back to top rhumbline Member Joined: 28 Sep 2007 Posts: 443 Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 7:38 pm    Post subject: Jaysit wrote: rhumbline wrote: Quick buck in the sense that they are not there with any sort of commitment to the airline or to uphold its service standards. As far as jobs are concerned most of these FAs are just school passouts who won't be able to get jobs anywhere besides being an FA when it comes down to it. Your comment would pass the laugh test only if Kingfisher's service standards were in the toilet. But their service standards are among the industry's highest. And much of that acclaim comes from the inflight service provided by its cabin crew. Plus, given their impeccable English skills (a quality that is often missing on such stalwarts as SQ, CX and TG), IT has a singular advantage over such larger, more established Asian mega-carriers. I am talking about consistency in service standards here. People have one off great experiences on 'heavens forbid' even AI so if I am paying top dollar for traveling with IT then I would expect a top dollar experience every time not as a one off of as a random event As far as English speaking skills are concerned we all know the skill levels in the Indian hinterlands. Jaysit wrote: Finally, as I've said before, the skills FAs bring to the table make or break a flight. They may not be able to sequence the human genome, but that isn't why they're there. They're part of the service industry, and good service in any endeavor is a highly skilled soft art upon which companies make or break their reputations. Don't knock it. Exactly thats what me and AKL are saying that at the moment the 'soft' skills and training imparted to IT FAs is incomplete (inadequate?) and more needs to be done to make a consistent product like 9Ws _________________ Learning is not compulsory. 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