Airliners-India Forum Index Airliners-India
Flickr Group & Facebook
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Caught again for filming at COK and on board

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Airliners-India Forum Index -> Aviation Law
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Theairplaneguy4ever
Member


Joined: 26 Sep 2012
Posts: 191
Location: Kochi, Kerala, India

PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:38 am    Post subject: Caught again for filming at COK and on board Reply with quote

So, I was flying from COK to TRV via MAA yesterday and I was caught not once but thrice along the journey. Would really appreciate it if somebody could point out what I was doing wrong.

Incident 1

At Kochi airport, I was shooting the arrival of a Saudia A333 and there were three security guards seated beside where I was standing. And one of them told me to stop very rudely. I proceeded to show him the DGCA order and he read it for some 15 mins. Then, told me that I can't shoot the apron as apron photography was prohibited. I ended up seeing the chief CISF officer and they still didn't budge. As I've learnt, when it comes to photography laws, its judged by where you take and not what you take. Still, it seemed impossible to negotiate with them, and I stopped.

So, the question is simple, whose at fault here?

Incident 2

Onboard 9W2730, I started my usual TRing. I'd actually shot a bit of the safety demo when the guy signalled to turn the cam off, politely though. Next after takeoff, he came and told me again very politely and smiling that safety demos are key (?) parts of the flight, and this particular plane is very fragile and I must pay attention (lol?) , I told him I did and he then told my that I had to switch off my cam for the TO and stuff. I showed him the next DGCA order and he said he understood rule 13 but it doesn't apply to electronic devices. He then said, he'll retrieve his copy of the rule and show it to me later.

After about 15 mins he came back and told me the same safety demos are key stuff and that I must not film personnel, I obliged. He then told me that it was okay to film TO and landing. He remained polite and friendly throughout though.

Incident 3

After I landed on board 9W844 from MAA at TRV, I asked for a flightdeck visit and was allowed. Just before entering the cabin crew there told me that it might not be possible to take photos, I said it was okay and went through. After a nice little chat with the captain, I asked if it were indeed possible to take any photos and he says that it's not a problem. After I did so and turn around to exit the aircraft, there's this guy who yells in my face asking if I took any photos, I calmly replied that I did. He, still yelling, asks me to show them. I do and then he demands me to delete them. Well, I didn't really care and did so. Satisfied now, he mutters something about a penalty and says I'm free to go.

I have no idea what the problem is in this case, anyone?

So that pretty much sums up one of my unluckiest ventures. This forum is pretty empty most of the time, but I do hope somebody ends up seeing this and helping me out. Would be great and I appreciate it.

And also, is there any advice that anyone can give in the future on such incidents given above, especially against uncooperative CISF guards?

Thanks a lot in advance![/b]
_________________
India's first HD Video Trip Report Channel : www.youtube.com/Theairplaneguy4ever
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sumantra
Member


Joined: 28 Oct 2007
Posts: 4389
Location: New Delhi

PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adi, I am extremely sorry to hear this. I have found the CISF at DEL and BOM to be knowledgeable about photography rules, but I guess some people at some locations are not in the know, or have their own interpretations of the rule. COK and MAA surprise me, since I have seen some lovely pictures from the airports around.
Cheers, Sumantra.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Theairplaneguy4ever
Member


Joined: 26 Sep 2012
Posts: 191
Location: Kochi, Kerala, India

PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sumantra wrote:
Adi, I am extremely sorry to hear this. I have found the CISF at DEL and BOM to be knowledgeable about photography rules, but I guess some people at some locations are not in the know, or have their own interpretations of the rule. COK and MAA surprise me, since I have seen some lovely pictures from the airports around.
Cheers, Sumantra.


Thanks.

It's the feeling of helplessness that annoys me the most, even if you're right, there's nothing you can do!
_________________
India's first HD Video Trip Report Channel : www.youtube.com/Theairplaneguy4ever
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HAWK21M
Member


Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 8120
Location: Mumbai, INDIA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bottom line is......NO TARMAC Photograhy while on the tarmac or at defence aerodromes.
As a pax from the seat you can click from within or an outside view.
If you are clicking an Individual, if you have not sought their permission for posting their pic ,you can be sued for it.

This is a rule which needs to be eliminated, this will provide fantastic views of Indian Airports in future.....
_________________
Think of the Brighter side !!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Theairplaneguy4ever
Member


Joined: 26 Sep 2012
Posts: 191
Location: Kochi, Kerala, India

PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HAWK21M wrote:
Bottom line is......NO TARMAC Photograhy while on the tarmac or at defence aerodromes.
As a pax from the seat you can click from within or an outside view.
If you are clicking an Individual, if you have not sought their permission for posting their pic ,you can be sued for it.

This is a rule which needs to be eliminated, this will provide fantastic views of Indian Airports in future.....


Thanks for responding Mel.

I haven't snapped any pictures on the tarmac, the people were accusing me of snapping pictures of the tarmac.

And about photographing other individuals, I think that the right to privacy is not guaranteed and the usage of any photos for both personal and commercial use is viable in India at least. But, this I'm not sure of. I guess it doesn't matter as the airline will just say that they make the rules on their aircraft and sue me anyway.

Do you have, say, any advice if I am wrongly accused as in incident one to use against unknowing CISF personnel.

Thanks!
_________________
India's first HD Video Trip Report Channel : www.youtube.com/Theairplaneguy4ever
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
C-GHKR
Member


Joined: 26 Dec 2006
Posts: 624
Location: yyz

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2013 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Theairplaneguy4ever wrote:

And about photographing other individuals, I think that the right to privacy is not guaranteed and the usage of any photos for both personal and commercial use is viable in India at least.

Thanks!


You can photograph an individual in a Public place, I don't think the cabin of 9W qualifies for that. Now publishing the photo of that individual requires a model release from him/her.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Theairplaneguy4ever
Member


Joined: 26 Sep 2012
Posts: 191
Location: Kochi, Kerala, India

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 6:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

C-GHKR wrote:
Theairplaneguy4ever wrote:

And about photographing other individuals, I think that the right to privacy is not guaranteed and the usage of any photos for both personal and commercial use is viable in India at least.

Thanks!


You can photograph an individual in a Public place, I don't think the cabin of 9W qualifies for that. Now publishing the photo of that individual requires a model release from him/her.


You make a good point there, but shouldn't 9W have a policy against it if that is the case?

I mean, AA have clearly stated on their site that filming crew, onboard procedures, etc. is prohibited while 9W doesn't say it,
so in turn it should be legal, right?

Thanks!

Theairplaneguy4ever
_________________
India's first HD Video Trip Report Channel : www.youtube.com/Theairplaneguy4ever
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
C-GHKR
Member


Joined: 26 Dec 2006
Posts: 624
Location: yyz

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_release

Note that the issue of model release forms and liability waivers is a legal area related to privacy and is separate from copyright. Also, the need for model releases pertains to public use of the photos: i.e., publishing them, commercially or not.
Basically it means you need permission to use their photos. This is in general for all types of photography. For an airline they can object at their discretion.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HAWK21M
Member


Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 8120
Location: Mumbai, INDIA

PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As mentioned.....you can click a pic of anyone, but if you plan to publish it then you'd need that person who is visible in that pic permission.
_________________
Think of the Brighter side !!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Theairplaneguy4ever
Member


Joined: 26 Sep 2012
Posts: 191
Location: Kochi, Kerala, India

PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a good look up about all of this and I'd thought I'd speak about my understanding of photographic laws on board the plane and off board.

VERY IMPORTANTLY : I am not a lawyer and this isn't legal advice. India's photographic laws may be different than the general opinion here. If anyone is aware of Indian photographic laws, I at least, would be grateful in you sharing your knowledge here.

Quote:
As mentioned.....you can click a pic of anyone, but if you plan to publish it then you'd need that person who is visible in that pic permission.


Have a look at this video by Matt Granger explaining Commercial use.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTfJcRbeYU8

Again, this is NOT specific to India and may be vastly different than what I think. But, publishing photos online or even selling them does not come under commercial use and hence does not require a model release. Commercial photography comes under endorsement of products by individuals for a company.The only country I can think of restricting public photography is France, with its rights to privacy.

Now, since photography is legal in Airports, public photography laws should apply and it should be okay to photograph people in the airports and publish those photos as well.

Now coming to the aircraft cabins.

As long as an airline doesn't explicitly state that photography is restricted in side the aircraft, it should be completely okay.

The most common airlines restricting this are UA and AA. Both have statements of these rules in their IFE magazines and their websites. So, unless an airline has such a policy (To my knowledge, none in India) it should be okay to photograph anything. But,

Quote:
For an airline they can object at their discretion.


as C-GHKR states, this could be right as well. Because, aircraft cabins are still private property. Although, I still think Airlines do need to declare their restrictions before accusing someone.

Now, I am again stressing that this is my interpretation and it could be wrong.

Finally, I was caught once again at Kochi airport for not having a useless airline tag on my camera.

Q. Does a camera (DSLR) come under the classification of a cabin baggage and thus require an airline tag on it?

If someone in the know could throw some light on all these issues in general it would be of great help to all of us trip reporters. So, thanks in advance.

Adi,

Theairplaneguy4ever
_________________
India's first HD Video Trip Report Channel : www.youtube.com/Theairplaneguy4ever
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The_Goat
Member


Joined: 03 Mar 2007
Posts: 2882
Location: South of France

PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HAWK21M wrote:
Bottom line is......NO TARMAC Photograhy while on the tarmac.


There have been several (rather beautiful) photographs of aircraft taken obviously from the tarmac at IGI's T3 on A.net recently. Are they all illegal then?
_________________
I don't know which is the more pampered bunch : AI's widebodies (the aunties) or Jet's widebodies (the planes).
-Jasepl
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
HAWK21M
Member


Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 8120
Location: Mumbai, INDIA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The_Goat wrote:
HAWK21M wrote:
Bottom line is......NO TARMAC Photograhy while on the tarmac.


There have been several (rather beautiful) photographs of aircraft taken obviously from the tarmac at IGI's T3 on A.net recently. Are they all illegal then?


If they are clicked from the tarmac,without special permission...they are.....
_________________
Think of the Brighter side !!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Airliners-India Forum Index -> Aviation Law All times are GMT + 5.5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group. Hosted by phpBB.BizHat.com