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Jeh
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

By the way:

I've been lurking around on the forum for a while now and will miss karatecatman's posts. My question is, is there any word on him coming back? Could any of the members who are regularly in contact with him ask him if he will return? I ask this because he was a reasoned pro-NACIL voice on the forum.

Somehow, I get the impression that the forum Moderators have some vendetta against anyone offering a pro-NACIL opinion - COUGAR vanished (probably banned by the same overzealous Moderation team), Phadnis vanished (probably also banned by the same overzealours Mods) and now karatecatman has been left with no option but to leave with the shabby way they treated him. Why is this so?

They seem to throw out anybody who argues against their collective opinion!
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Nimish
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 11, 2010 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
By the way:

I've been lurking around on the forum for a while now and will miss karatecatman's posts. My question is, is there any word on him coming back? Could any of the members who are regularly in contact with him ask him if he will return? I ask this because he was a reasoned pro-NACIL voice on the forum.


Please refer http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=9287 for any further info on the KCM topic.

Jeh wrote:

Somehow, I get the impression that the forum Moderators have some vendetta against anyone offering a pro-NACIL opinion - COUGAR vanished (probably banned by the same overzealous Moderation team), Phadnis vanished (probably also banned by the same overzealours Mods) and now karatecatman has been left with no option but to leave with the shabby way they treated him. Why is this so?

They seem to throw out anybody who argues against their collective opinion!


Please refer http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=20 for the forum rules. Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here. Anyone who wants to, is more than welcome to become an active contributing member on the forum, and then can join the moderators when we ask for the rotational mod. Help make this place what you want it to be.
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Jeh
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2010 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nimish wrote:

Please refer http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=9287 for any further info on the KCM topic.


Actually, sir, I do possess a modicum of intelligence. I wanted to know if there was any progress on getting karatecatman back since the last post had been made on that thread.

Nimish wrote:

Please refer http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=20 for the forum rules. Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here. Anyone who wants to, is more than welcome to become an active contributing member on the forum, and then can join the moderators when we ask for the rotational mod. Help make this place what you want it to be.

Hilarious, sir. Are all your jokes this good? None of the members whom I think you've banned broke the forum rules to a greater degree than others who have been allowed to stay on. That's why I asked if there is a marked bias in Moderation. The Mods' belief seems to be "Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here...unless, of course, he follows the herd mentality and agrees with us, in which case he can do as he pleases". Dreadfully petty Moderation, to say the least. Rolling Eyes

@ HAWK21M: Mods will earn 'popularity' if their Moderation reflects consistency and a lack of bias. Neither trait of Moderation is visible on this forum. The disgraceful treatment of karatecatman follows in the long line of insulting and persecuting members who dare to disagree with the Mods' chamchas. In other words, petty Moderation. Most undeserving of respect, let alone popularity.

GET KARATECATMAN BACK, for crying out loud!
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JETFLY787
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:

Hilarious, sir. Are all your jokes this good? None of the members whom I think you've banned broke the forum rules to a greater degree than others who have been allowed to stay on. That's why I asked if there is a marked bias in Moderation. The Mods' belief seems to be "Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here...unless, of course, he follows the herd mentality and agrees with us, in which case he can do as he pleases". Dreadfully petty Moderation, to say the least. Rolling Eyes

@ HAWK21M: Mods will earn 'popularity' if their Moderation reflects consistency and a lack of bias. Neither trait of Moderation is visible on this forum. The disgraceful treatment of karatecatman follows in the long line of insulting and persecuting members who dare to disagree with the Mods' chamchas. In other words, petty Moderation. Most undeserving of respect, let alone popularity.

GET KARATECATMAN BACK, for crying out loud!


^^^^^^

Ouch...Don't do this to the Mods man.. you may have to leave as well like KCM.
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Spiderguy252
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
Hilarious, sir. Are all your jokes this good? None of the members whom I think you've banned broke the forum rules to a greater degree than others who have been allowed to stay on. That's why I asked if there is a marked bias in Moderation. The Mods' belief seems to be "Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here...unless, of course, he follows the herd mentality and agrees with us, in which case he can do as he pleases". Dreadfully petty Moderation, to say the least. Rolling Eyes


Hmmmm.........now why would a brand new member who has just touched double digits flare up like that? Very Happy

Jeh, once a member is banned/chooses to leave the forum, he is not allowed to create new accounts and post or ask others to do so on their behalf. And no member can hijack a thread and demand for the reinstatement of an older member, let alone one who posted before this member had even signed up.

I mean if you know COUGAR and Phadnis and the like, you wouldn't have been a "guest" on the forum, mate.

Jeh wrote:
@ HAWK21M: Mods will earn 'popularity' if their Moderation reflects consistency and a lack of bias. Neither trait of Moderation is visible on this forum. The disgraceful treatment of karatecatman follows in the long line of insulting and persecuting members who dare to disagree with the Mods' chamchas. In other words, petty Moderation. Most undeserving of respect, let alone popularity.


Eh? Mel was referring to the spotting community, as is what the thread is talking about. Laughing

My first offensive post on the board, but as long as it's to a fake account, I don't care.
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sammyk
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:

Hilarious, sir. Are all your jokes this good? None of the members whom I think you've banned broke the forum rules to a greater degree than others who have been allowed to stay on. That's why I asked if there is a marked bias in Moderation. The Mods' belief seems to be "Anyone not following these rules is NOT WELCOME here...unless, of course, he follows the herd mentality and agrees with us, in which case he can do as he pleases". Dreadfully petty Moderation, to say the least. Rolling Eyes

@ HAWK21M: Mods will earn 'popularity' if their Moderation reflects consistency and a lack of bias. Neither trait of Moderation is visible on this forum. The disgraceful treatment of karatecatman follows in the long line of insulting and persecuting members who dare to disagree with the Mods' chamchas. In other words, petty Moderation. Most undeserving of respect, let alone popularity.


What rules have others broken? Go ahead, point them out please. Mods don't see EVERYTHING so if you do then why not bring it to our attention?

What's interesting is that COUGAR was NOT an AI supporter, he was an IC supporter, and perhaps Airbus. Phadnis, ok, AI guy. What about Texdravid? Oh you forgot him did you? He too was NOT an AI supporter. I think he even called it the National Shame, but I could be wrong. Also, COUGAR and Tex are free to come back, their bans were lifted long ago. So there goes your theory of mods being against pro-NACIL members.

As mentioned, Mel was talking about the spotters but anyways. How was KCM disgracefully treated? How is it OK for him to be disrespectful to moderation but the opposite causes an uproar?

See the problem is you only see one side. You don't see the PMs, emails, and deleted posts. If you did you would more than understand the situation.

Also, KCM can come back ANYTIME he wants. It's up to him. He will not be begged or pleaded to come back. No invitation will be sent. It will be at his own free will.
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Jeh
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiderguy252 wrote:
Hmmmm.........now why would a brand new member who has just touched double digits flare up like that? Very Happy

Jeh, once a member is banned/chooses to leave the forum, he is not allowed to create new accounts and post or ask others to do so on their behalf. And no member can hijack a thread and demand for the reinstatement of an older member, let alone one who posted before this member had even signed up.

I mean if you know COUGAR and Phadnis and the like, you wouldn't have been a "guest" on the forum, mate.

My first offensive post on the board, but as long as it's to a fake account, I don't care.
Wink


The treatment to karatecatman was what prompted my outburst - it seems as if nobody cares what the quality of the forum is like, as long as the Mods' commands are obeyed. Think of it - as of now, only avbuff actually continues to provide some info on schedules, aviation scoops and suchlike, and we're greatful to him. But beyond him, there is no one. Thus, we need karatecatman to revive the forum.

As a guest on the forum, I have read a lot of karatecatman's and Phadnis and COUGAR's posts and understood their views, and I never understood what they did wrong. SInce I share these views on both the Moderation and on issues, I posted accordingly. Please show me a forum rule where it says that "a brand new member who has just touched double digits" is not allowed to share the views of past members and criticise the Modertion team? And what is this bullshit about "no member can hijack a thread and demand for the reinstatement of an older member". What forum rules are you inventing, 'mate', and more to the point, who the heck do you think you are to tell me this?


And while most other banned members including COUGAR and Phadnis never provided any real valuable info and were mostly interested in opinions & rabble-rousing, karatecatman was a valuable contributor. I'm not interested in the others, although I believe the Moderation was flawed, but I still think karatecatman must return. And as for hijacking the thread, sorry 'mate', but the other thread is locked. Unlock it and I'll stop the hijacking and post there. Simple innit?

As for your allgations of fake account, I assure you Im not a spammer. This account and I are as real as your account and yourself.

As for this:
Spiderguy252 wrote:
"once a member is banned, he is not allowed to create new accounts and post or ask others to do so on their behalf. And no member can hijack a thread and demand for the reinstatement of an older member, let alone one who posted before this member had even signed up"


I take it that this means karatecatman has been banned and that you believe I am karatecatman, or somebody posting on his behalf? Dear God. Am I not even allowed to exprss a view without you making accusations? Rolling Eyes Alright, since you share Nimish views, am I to believe that you are actually Nimish posting under another account name? What complete nonsense!
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Jeh
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sammyk wrote:
What rules have others broken? Go ahead, point them out please. Mods don't see EVERYTHING so if you do then why not bring it to our attention?

What's interesting is that COUGAR was NOT an AI supporter, he was an IC supporter, and perhaps Airbus. Phadnis, ok, AI guy. What about Texdravid? Oh you forgot him did you? He too was NOT an AI supporter. I think he even called it the National Shame, but I could be wrong. Also, COUGAR and Tex are free to come back, their bans were lifted long ago. So there goes your theory of mods being against pro-NACIL members.

As mentioned, Mel was talking about the spotters but anyways. How was KCM disgracefully treated? How is it OK for him to be disrespectful to moderation but the opposite causes an uproar?

See the problem is you only see one side. You don't see the PMs, emails, and deleted posts. If you did you would more than understand the situation.

Also, KCM can come back ANYTIME he wants. It's up to him. He will not be begged or pleaded to come back. No invitation will be sent. It will be at his own free will.


I'm sorry I don't have the patience to go rummaging through past threads like a tattle-tale and complain to the Mods. It's their bloody job to control the forum, but off the top of my head I remembr moments when I read something and felt that the member was stepping out of line.

I was talking about pro-NACIL - AI or IC doesn't matter to me, like with COUGAR. karatecatman, or KCM as you call him (I will use this shorthand it is easier) said in many threads that he was upset at the Moderators, and I understand why.

Im sorry but I can't possible see PMs emails and deleted posts, so I'd never know who was doing what to whom. Both KCM and the Mods behaved pettily perhaps, but KCM's departure is the forum's loss, not KCM's. Thus we should call him back.
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Spiderguy252
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
The treatment to karatecatman was what prompted my outburst - it seems as if nobody cares what the quality of the forum is like, as long as the Mods' commands are obeyed. Think of it - as of now, only avbuff actually continues to provide some info on schedules, aviation scoops and suchlike, and we're greatful to him. But beyond him, there is no one. Thus, we need karatecatman to revive the forum.


Right, you have to take my word for this: Member karatecatman was never banned. He chose to leave the forum on his own free will, due to a kiddish reason of a thread title. In case you've been around the Internet around a lot you always get to see one member sharing a ton of content on a forum. Well, that member was kcm for this board. You'd also notice that such members after a certain point get pissed at the website for one reason or the other and choose to pack up one fine day and leave. I don't know why that happens but it does. There is always this mundane thing that pushes him over and that's when he calls it quits. I've been on forums long enough to figure out this was exactly what happened to kcm, and the change in thread title was the final straw. kcm wouldn't have left had he been a newbie like yourself when he saw the thread title change, trust me.

And there are a billion people in this country. Anybody is free to sign up and share industry related news with the rest of us. "Bring karatecatman back" is just laughable and childish. Why, since you're so concerned about the issue I implore you to "save this forum".

Jeh wrote:

As for this:
Spiderguy252 wrote:
"once a member is banned, he is not allowed to create new accounts and post or ask others to do so on their behalf. And no member can hijack a thread and demand for the reinstatement of an older member, let alone one who posted before this member had even signed up"


I take it that this means karatecatman has been banned and that you believe I am karatecatman, or somebody posting on his behalf? Dear God. Am I not even allowed to exprss a view without you making accusations? Rolling Eyes Alright, since you share Nimish views, am I to believe that you are actually Nimish posting under another account name? What complete nonsense!


We are Mods you know? We do have some access to some browsing data. And the PMs I've been receiving only confirm my suspicions. Wink
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Aseem
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
KCM's departure is the forum's loss, not KCM's. Thus we should call him back.


As has been stated many times over by now, we are not going to invite KCM. If it pleases him, then he can re-register and continue contribute. This is our final position!

Aseem
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sammyk
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:


I'm sorry I don't have the patience to go rummaging through past threads like a tattle-tale and complain to the Mods. It's their bloody job to control the forum, but off the top of my head I remembr moments when I read something and felt that the member was stepping out of line.

I was talking about pro-NACIL - AI or IC doesn't matter to me, like with COUGAR. karatecatman, or KCM as you call him (I will use this shorthand it is easier) said in many threads that he was upset at the Moderators, and I understand why.

Im sorry but I can't possible see PMs emails and deleted posts, so I'd never know who was doing what to whom. Both KCM and the Mods behaved pettily perhaps, but KCM's departure is the forum's loss, not KCM's. Thus we should call him back.


No one is asking to go around looking for anything but if you come across something then why not inform the mods? As said, it is impossible to see everything that goes on.

What was KCM upset about? Obviously more than this past episode. Moderation has actually been pretty lenient with him allowing to post information without a source (which is technically against rules) and posting things in the wrong forum. While all rules may not be strictly enforced one should not take advantage of this.

I know you haven't seen the PMs and emails, that is my point. Had you seen them you would have a better understanding of the situation.

KCM was not banned and not asked to leave, he left on his own. No one wanted this. If he wants to come back he can do so at anytime. If his ego is so big that he wants an invitation to come back then that's his problem as it's not going to happen.
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PAL@YWG
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
KCM was not banned and not asked to leave, he left on his own. No one wanted this. If he wants to come back he can do so at anytime. If his ego is so big that he wants an invitation to come back then that's his problem as it's not going to happen.


May I, on behalf of all aviation enthusiasts who are missing KCM, request KCM to come back.

On this forum, we all are doing our bits to share and receive information on Indian aviation and let's keep that bigger picture in mind. Let's not fight on Rules, Ego etc etc.

KCM, come back please!
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Jeh
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spiderguy252 wrote:
Right, you have to take my word for this: Member karatecatman was never banned. He chose to leave the forum on his own free will, due to a kiddish reason of a thread title. In case you've been around the Internet around a lot you always get to see one member sharing a ton of content on a forum. Well, that member was kcm for this board. You'd also notice that such members after a certain point get pissed at the website for one reason or the other and choose to pack up one fine day and leave. I don't know why that happens but it does. There is always this mundane thing that pushes him over and that's when he calls it quits. I've been on forums long enough to figure out this was exactly what happened to kcm, and the change in thread title was the final straw. kcm wouldn't have left had he been a newbie like yourself when he saw the thread title change, trust me.

And there are a billion people in this country. Anybody is free to sign up and share industry related news with the rest of us. "Bring karatecatman back" is just laughable and childish. Why, since you're so concerned about the issue I implore you to "save this forum".


More than any desperate concern to "save this forum", I have always relied on the forum for news on aviation, which karatecatman provided. I read in passing hints about his and other members' annoyance with Mods, and it might seem random/sudden/arbtrary when I mention it here like this, but I intended to put this in the bring-KCM-back thread in Non-Aviation Forum. Just happens that that thred was "Locked". So I posted here.

And again regarding this:
Spiderguy252 wrote:

We are Mods you know? We do have some access to some browsing data. And the PMs I've been receiving only confirm my suspicions. Wink


Pray enligten me.
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Jeh
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PAL@YWG wrote:
May I, on behalf of all aviation enthusiasts who are missing KCM, request KCM to come back.

On this forum, we all are doing our bits to share and receive information on Indian aviation and let's keep that bigger picture in mind. Let's not fight on Rules, Ego etc etc.

KCM, come back please!


Amen
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con spirito
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:


I'm sorry I don't have the patience to go rummaging through past threads like a tattle-tale and complain to the Mods. It's their bloody job to control the forum, but off the top of my head I remembr moments when I read something and felt that the member was stepping out of line.



Look mate, if you dont have the patience to have a look at the past threads, i believe you shouldnt make statements about Mods doing this and that. If they would've allowed KCM to create duplicate threads, every other tom, dick and harry would do the same and the very purpose of this forum would be lost. And Im only talking about the KCM incident.
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me111993
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
Spiderguy252 wrote:
Right, you have to take my word for this: Member karatecatman was never banned. He chose to leave the forum on his own free will, due to a kiddish reason of a thread title. In case you've been around the Internet around a lot you always get to see one member sharing a ton of content on a forum. Well, that member was kcm for this board. You'd also notice that such members after a certain point get pissed at the website for one reason or the other and choose to pack up one fine day and leave. I don't know why that happens but it does. There is always this mundane thing that pushes him over and that's when he calls it quits. I've been on forums long enough to figure out this was exactly what happened to kcm, and the change in thread title was the final straw. kcm wouldn't have left had he been a newbie like yourself when he saw the thread title change, trust me.

And there are a billion people in this country. Anybody is free to sign up and share industry related news with the rest of us. "Bring karatecatman back" is just laughable and childish. Why, since you're so concerned about the issue I implore you to "save this forum".


More than any desperate concern to "save this forum", I have always relied on the forum for news on aviation, which karatecatman provided. I read in passing hints about his and other members' annoyance with Mods, and it might seem random/sudden/arbtrary when I mention it here like this, but I intended to put this in the bring-KCM-back thread in Non-Aviation Forum. Just happens that that thred was "Locked". So I posted here.

And again regarding this:
Spiderguy252 wrote:

We are Mods you know? We do have some access to some browsing data. And the PMs I've been receiving only confirm my suspicions. Wink


Pray enligten me.




Jeh, how long have you been on this forum, that you are feeling this loss striken at kcm's leaving?? I mean, if you have been following aviation news and articles you would most definately have something to discuss, comment or express your views on, you merely have 14 posts, and most of them regarding this issue!! Where have you been all this while?? And please dont tell me that kcm's withdrawl prompted you to honour us and finally join this forum to intervene on the state of affairs here.
Kcm's posts were without doubt very valuable but it was completely his choice to leave and is upto him to return, as stated many times by moderators and administrators alike, why do we need to drag this issue along is something beyond me...

me111993
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Nimish
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mod note: I've split these posts out from the original spotters thread. The intention is to let that thread continue unhindered, while we discuss this in a separate thread.

Mod note2: I wasn't able to think of a suitable title for this thread, hence chose "Venting", but will change it if there's a better alternative.
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HAWK21M
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I keep in touch thru most Anetter on Phone/Email.So its a forum that helps build contacts with similiar minded persons.I still keep in touch with many ex members too as with existing ones.

I have sms'd KCM of some people desiring him back on the forum,but ultimitely its his choice to choose so.No one would force or request KCM to do return or quit.

True...KCM was a good contributer in terms of news & his posts would def be missed.

What transpired between KCM & the mods are known only to them.

Personally I wish all see the big picture of Aviation & work towards it.

cheers.
regds
MEL.
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Nimish
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So to summarize what I've seen been discussed here:

Issue 1: Folks want KCM back.
- Guess what - I do to. And further - he's free to come back as he was never sent off in the first place. Anything else? The previous thread was locked for a good reason!! There is nothing more to discuss, but please feel free to start an online petition or something on "Bring KCM back", since there's nothing else the mods can do.

Issue 2: Moderation is "partial" and anti-AI
- Everyone's invited to contribute to this forum, and contributors are welcome to become mods. We've had maybe 3-4 mods from the members in the past few years, and Spiderguy had to continue for another 6 months due to lack of interest from other members to become a mod. IMO - that takes away any moral right for members to complain about the issue (of Moderation being "partial") - we give everyone the tools to fix issues, but members choose to leave the tools aside and spend time cribbing. Well I guess it's easier and more fun to crib.

Issue 3: Dreadfully petty Moderation, to say the least.
- Refer issue 2 above

Issue 4: "It seems as if nobody cares what the quality of the forum is like"
- Sorry but what gave you that idea? Is your claim that one members presence or absence defines the "Quality" of the forum? If that's the case, it wouldn't be AI.net with a gazillion other posts/ posters, it would be that member's personal blog. Which it isn't.

Issue 5: Thus, we need karatecatman to revive the forum.
- Once again - refer issue 1.

Issue 6: "It's their bloody job to control the forum"
- Well - thanks for that vote of confidence, and that's exactly what we've been doing. Just our bloody jobs.
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HAWK21M
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 8120
Location: Mumbai, INDIA

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

KCM....has reverted back that he has not visited the forum since he quit,but he will def consider returning.......Personally I hope krishna does return to post for the data provided to the forum in terms of news.

I wish I could contact all the ex members & ask them to return back for the sake of AVIATION.Maybe I will do it just once.

Smile

We need a lot of posts & discusion/debates for this forum to reach greater heights & we have the people out here to do so.

regds
MEL.
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Jeh
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010
Posts: 656
Location: Delhi, India

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

me111993 wrote:
Jeh, how long have you been on this forum, that you are feeling this loss striken at kcm's leaving?? I mean, if you have been following aviation news and articles you would most definately have something to discuss, comment or express your views on, you merely have 14 posts, and most of them regarding this issue!! Where have you been all this while?? And please dont tell me that kcm's withdrawl prompted you to honour us and finally join this forum to intervene on the state of affairs here.
Kcm's posts were without doubt very valuable but it was completely his choice to leave and is upto him to return, as stated many times by moderators and administrators alike, why do we need to drag this issue along is something beyond me...

me111993


Because, my dear friend, that is of essence. I have already repeated ad nauseam that I have been visiting this forum quite consistently to access aviation news and a bit of the debate. Suddenly KCM left and there was a void, so I decided to join in and do something to get him back, ego or no ego. KCM's views seemed to match my own closet beliefs regarding aviation in India, although he wasn't that much into opinion. Hence too, I am sad to see him go.

As for "where have you been all this while" - I, sir, happen to have a life outside of this forum. And why the heck is that of any concern to you anyway? If I didn't want to post and was content to quietly read the news on this forum, and then felt I ought to raise my voice within the rules of the forum for my personal reasons, why the heck does it bother you? I doubt you're a Moderator, so if you're not, you can go to Beelzebub. And what is your effing problem if I'm concerned about this forum even though I've only just started posting? Is there a rule that says that members can only show concern for the forum after tey've posted 100 posts minimum? WTF? Why do all the counter-arguments seem to hinge around me being a newly posting member?
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Nimish
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Joined: 16 Dec 2006
Posts: 9755
Location: Bangalore, India

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HAWK21M wrote:
KCM....has reverted back that he has not visited the forum since he quit,but he will def consider returning.......Personally I hope krishna does return to post for the data provided to the forum in terms of news.


That's great news!
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sammyk
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Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 2719
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At this point I hope KCM returns just so Jeh can go back into hibernation.






Razz
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AirIndia0001
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Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 391

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Mel for getting in touch with KCM for the larger good of this forum.
Sorry to say this... but the feeling I got from this unfortunate episode is that if KCM acted childishly, then some (not all) on our moderation team also appeared to be doing likewise. The only casualty of this "ego-battle" was (and is) AI.Net.

As for some, alleging that Jeh is a fake... hope their responses are purely as members (and not as *Mods*)... as it does not reflect well on their part to accuse a fellow member without access to some proof.

my 2 cents.
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AKLDELNonstop
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1066
Location: Auckland

PostPosted: Wed Apr 14, 2010 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aah, some good early morning entertainment. Helps the day go by.
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Jeh
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010
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Location: Delhi, India

PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sammyk wrote:
At this point I hope KCM returns just so Jeh can go back into hibernation

Deliciously nasty verbal joust Very Happy

HAWK21M wrote:
KCM....has reverted back that he has not visited the forum since he quit,but he will def consider returning.......Personally I hope krishna does return to post for the data provided to the forum in terms of news.


Excellent news! Very Happy sammyk will be delighted...or not, as it were.
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Aseem
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Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 2699
Location: YYZ

PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
Excellent news! Very Happy sammyk will be delighted...or not, as it were.


Saying in my personal capacity. You may be right in your own right, but you're campaign hasn't been close to ideal either. You completely changed the complection of decent starting post by Sumantra!
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Jeh
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010
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Location: Delhi, India

PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aseem wrote:
Saying in my personal capacity. You may be right in your own right, but you're campaign hasn't been close to ideal either. You completely changed the complection of decent starting post by Sumantra!

I do apologise, sir, but the thread was locked and I tried to 'vent' elsewhere Smile

I'm sure other members share my views, although not so extreme - personally I was very disappointed to see a great news source dry up like that! I may have started posting only recently but I have been 'active' in my own way i.e. reading without seeing the need to become a member.
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sammyk
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Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 2719
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jeh wrote:
sammyk wrote:
At this point I hope KCM returns just so Jeh can go back into hibernation

Deliciously nasty verbal joust Very Happy

HAWK21M wrote:
KCM....has reverted back that he has not visited the forum since he quit,but he will def consider returning.......Personally I hope krishna does return to post for the data provided to the forum in terms of news.


Excellent news! Very Happy sammyk will be delighted...or not, as it were.


I was just joking hence the smiley.
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TKMCE
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Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 957

PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey HAWK21M

For sure, I ( and I am sure there are many others here also) miss your moderation and the high standards you set! Sad
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HAWK21M
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 8120
Location: Mumbai, INDIA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TKMCE wrote:
Hey HAWK21M

For sure, I ( and I am sure there are many others here also) miss your moderation and the high standards you set! Sad


Rajiv.....Thanks,but I guess you are being nice to me, I believe the current mods are doing a great job too,its just that there is a conflict between implementing the rules,without a member being offended & a member following the rules without getting into an arguement with a mod.

If both the mods & members use less sensitive responses....There is no issue at all.

Mods should not sound like school principals while implementing rules & members need to respect the mods decision in implementing the rules,as they need to keep discipline in the forum.

Finally its Aviation that needs to benefit.This needs to be understood by all.Everyone can be brave behind a computer screen Smile

cheers
regds
MEL.
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TKMCE
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Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 957

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok Mel, you have done me a favor by saying what I wanted to say for a long time.

Quote:
Posted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 12:43 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

TKMCE wrote:
Hey HAWK21M

For sure, I ( and I am sure there are many others here also) miss your moderation and the high standards you set!


Rajiv.....Thanks,but I guess you are being nice to me, I believe the current mods are doing a great job too,its just that there is a conflict between implementing the rules,without a member being offended & a member following the rules without getting into an arguement with a mod.

If both the mods & members use less sensitive responses....There is no issue at all.

Mods should not sound like school principals while implementing rules & members need to respect the mods decision in implementing the rules,as they need to keep discipline in the forum.



Now the second part is equally important I agree, but am I wrong in thinking that KCMs reaction (and let me again repeat I dont know KCM other than through these forums and I am no proxy for him ) was brought about due to some highly "military school type" moderation!!!!

And is it being applied uniformly - answer is no!!! More than a year back on one of the threads there was highly objectionable image posted and was finally removed after I protested to the mods but no where could I find any sort of public reprimand to the member in question as was being given to KCM with impunity in some of these forums. I am not saying a public reprimand is necessary but if you do - do it uniformly, not to a select few!!! Look at Team-BHP, they are also strict, I have been at the receiving end as well but one thing everyone will tell you including me is they are CONSISTENT.

The membership list here if you take one look at it is now a spammers heaven.

Yeah - you can bounce it back to people like me saying -take up the job of a rotational mod - answeris I cant do is for two reasons - one shortage of time like anyone else, and 2, even if I become a rotational mod - in no time I will be hounded out since I willll invariably clash against some of the "platinum" members here and may be a few (not all ) of the mods! So I stay out Rolling Eyes


To sum it up - KCM may have over reacted but his overeeaction was also brought about by some equally childish moderation!!!!
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Spiderguy252
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Joined: 10 Aug 2007
Posts: 4256
Location: Indian Ocean

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TKMCE, please post your version of what you think happened between us and karatecatman.

It will be full of holes and incomplete facts. As sammyk said, all you members get to see are some debris of a few deleted or edited posts, not the live PMs, not the rude emails, not anything else that happened at that moment.

Face it- you have no idea what went on. You neither have proof that the moderators behaved childlishly nor anything to suggest karatecatman's immature outburst either. You are blindly taking one party's side just for the sake of it.
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sammyk
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Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 2719
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, you only see what happens when something like this comes out in the open. One assumes that this was the first time it happened. Quite honestly this was not the first time. As mentioned, KCM was given quite a bit of leeway with the rules because of the nature of his posts. I guess this made him think he was above them.

Mods/Admins made a decision about threads and made an announcement within the thread to advise posters of this decision and how they should post AI related news in the future. We had no obligation to consult with anyone about it. This is no different than on ANY message board anywhere. KCM was the one that made it public. He could have sent a nice PM/Email and asked us about it but nope, he threw a tantrum in public.

TKMCE, I don't remember it but I'm sure whoever posted the "objectionable image" was warned as it was likely a first offense. Of course you wouldn't know this as it happens behind the scenes, same way as KCMs previous issues were dealt with.

Once again, I ask members, if you see rules being broken and nothing done about it please shoot us a PM.
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sammyk
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Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 2719
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TKMCE wrote:

The membership list here if you take one look at it is now a spammers heaven.


Just to add, the "spammers" on the member list has nothing to do with the quality of the forum. These sort of "members" are a problem on all message boards. The software used on this board is free and does not have a lot of the features other boards have to filter these sorts of members.
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Aseem
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Joined: 15 Dec 2006
Posts: 2699
Location: YYZ

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TKMCE wrote:
To sum it up - KCM may have over reacted but his overeeaction was also brought about by some equally childish moderation!!!!


Sorry but can't hold it any longer. Sometime back KCM had the audacity to call me "schizo" in PM, and could get away because he didn't break any forum rules and he got some leeway due to his contribution. Call this a childish moderation! I am sorry but I am not commenting any further on this topic.
Members can use this thread to vent out as much as they want. They can also try finding any other forum where they can as much liberty!
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TKMCE
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Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 957

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok Sammy and Spider - This is what I felt was childish- maybe from both sides but most certainly not from one side only as is being made out by you blokes - but then it is my personal opinion but one which obviously has support from atleast one respected member here of this forum who has mentioned it in thie current thread himself. http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/airlinersindia-ftopic9208.html

And believe me you blokes may not realise it , what I may be expressing publicly in this forum is also the opinion of quite a few others as well who are getting disenchanted by what is happening around here. Most (and I was one of those initially) were just leaving it alone - and keeping away from the forums- as it seemed the easiest thing to do - but then as I said some of us here have been around much longer than some of you blokes and I thought let me atleast make a point publicly before we leave (or are asked to leave).

I dont subscribe to KCMs views on seniority (and I dont post here to get my 10 minutes of fame) but I am sad at what I see as "immature moderation" driving out an icnreasing number of key members who added value to the forum (as against the innumerable zero posting members who are enrolled here).

Cheers


Cheers
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TKMCE
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Joined: 27 Feb 2007
Posts: 957

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aseem

Let me make it clear - I dont know KCM, nor do I subscribe to all his views like that of seniority - and most defintiely inexcusable language if it is true. And when I speak of disenchanted memebers , it does not include KCM (with whom I never had any contact even through PMs).

Hwoever I stand by my views!!!
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Aseem
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thnx Rajeev! The last thing this forum would want is members stop conveying their grievances to the moderators and at the same time being understanding of their position.
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sammyk
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Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 2719
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TKMCE wrote:
Ok Sammy and Spider - This is what I felt was childish- maybe from both sides but most certainly not from one side only as is being made out by you blokes - but then it is my personal opinion but one which obviously has support from atleast one respected member here of this forum who has mentioned it in thie current thread himself. http://airlinersindia.s4.bizhat.com/airlinersindia-ftopic9208.html

And believe me you blokes may not realise it , what I may be expressing publicly in this forum is also the opinion of quite a few others as well who are getting disenchanted by what is happening around here. Most (and I was one of those initially) were just leaving it alone - and keeping away from the forums- as it seemed the easiest thing to do - but then as I said some of us here have been around much longer than some of you blokes and I thought let me atleast make a point publicly before we leave (or are asked to leave).

I dont subscribe to KCMs views on seniority (and I dont post here to get my 10 minutes of fame) but I am sad at what I see as "immature moderation" driving out an icnreasing number of key members who added value to the forum (as against the innumerable zero posting members who are enrolled here).

Cheers


Cheers


What have I said that is childish in the post you linked? Could you please explain your opinion.

What is "happening around here"? I keep hearing this from those that comment but they never go into specifics. Just claim immature or overzealous moderation, etc. When asked they say they have no time to explain or we should know, etc. Please, do tell, or give examples of what is causing this disenchantment you speak of. How can admins/mods correct a problem if they are not made aware of it and given only vague information?

We all want this forum to succeed but your feedback is essential to this.
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