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tsk911
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 Posted: Wed Dec 27, 2006 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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| HAWK21M wrote: | | VABBy wrote: |
I guess LCD tv,s are commonly available and dirt cheap nowdays got one in my car. . |
Is that a TV or a monitor.
regds
MEL |
The LCD's for cars are compact and slimmer than the LCD Monitors. They are usually drop downs from roof (the opening) or standing.
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HAWK21M
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:00 am Post subject: |
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The Indigo version has the Back of the Fwd seat fitted with LCD screens.
regds
MEL
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Boeing7xx
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 11:39 am Post subject: |
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| The car or the airline? The airline was 'sposed to be a LCC right? |
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AKLDELNonstop
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:28 pm Post subject: |
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Definitely the car mate. LOL but i Dont blame you. My first reaction was the same, I was going to ask when did IndiGos get PTVs and then realised he was talkin bout the car.
Cheers
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tsk911
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Boeing7xx wrote: | | The car or the airline? The airline was 'sposed to be a LCC right? |
I was even confused. Tata Indigo SXi has LCD screens.
Kingfisher started off as a LCC, but evetually became a full service carrier. I think only Air Deccan, Spicejet and Go Air follow a true LCC concept in India.
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the_380
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| tsk911 wrote: |
Kingfisher started off as a LCC, but evetually became a full service carrier. |
  
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Karan69
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 3:54 pm Post subject: Is IT worth the fuss?? |
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When it comes to IT and VJM one has to look into the long run is it really worth the fuss??
I have taken the trouble to write so please take a few moments of your life to read it.
No doubt he has been innovative and has captured reasonable market share from the likes of 9W especially on trunk routes.
On CNN IBN he claimed that his yield is more than twice as that of an LCC on the same route however what he fails to mention is that his cost is also twice if not thrice as high.
How---
He pays his cabin crew much more than what anyone else pays--ofcourse they are afterall wannabe models
His aircraft will have greater fuel burn than that of DNs as they are heavier because of the IFE equipment in them.
His ATRs---are fitted with PTVs which is absolutely useless and i guess almost everyone agrees with me on this one, but i have read one or two trip reports of pax saying that the ATRs dint have the PTVs which is well done in my opinion.
Updating IFE for every flight on a weekly bases getting broadcast rights for new programmes, agreed advt opportuniteis are there but does it justify buying the rights of certain programmes,
Meal costs --an avg economy airline meal cost 8-12 USD and the way VJM does it i am sure its more----in the case of DN negligible food and entertainment cost.
His future businees plan is based purely on chance----If the dgca reduces the flying limit to 3 yrs or he acquires/starts an airline USA--does he really think it is as simple as that look at the probleem a dude like Richard Branson is having with Virgin America.
Some of yoll may argue that he will do well in International market--he might just but he has to survive till then---What if the flying rights are even reduced to 3 yrs [may 2008 for him] what does he do with 2 A330-200s that he will recieve for around 6-8 mths prior???
will it be done in time for him to acquire market share because by then the market will probably be saturated with 9W/AI and the foreigners AF/BA/LH/SQ flooding the market with WB Cheap tickets and Convinient connections as they have deep pockets. and to have a first movers advantage.
Agreed VJM also has deep pockets but are they as deep as the govts. of France Sin Germany England--also will his Shareholders approve him withdrawing funds from UB grup holdings considering that his airline is using 50-60 lakhs a day.
Even when it comes to 9W they are in certain situations that are similar to KingFisher but varaibly different in a good kind of way for 9W--yoll know what i am referring to i do not need to state the Obvious.
Karan |
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tsk911
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:31 pm Post subject: |
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If VJM is able to impress shareholder, then why won't they agree? Even though there is time left for IT to go public, but if people are guaranteed high returns, then they won't be reluctant to invest. Moreover, if tomorrow VJM announces lucrative schemes for shareholders? What say? VJM is quite unpredictable and guessing his next move cent % right is impossible.
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the_380
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:47 pm Post subject: Re: Is IT worth the fuss?? |
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| Karan69 wrote: | How---
He pays his cabin crew much more than what anyone else pays--ofcourse they are afterall wannabe models
His aircraft will have greater fuel burn than that of DNs as they are heavier because of the IFE equipment in them.
His ATRs---are fitted with PTVs which is absolutely useless and i guess almost everyone agrees with me on this one, but i have read one or two trip reports of pax saying that the ATRs dint have the PTVs which is well done in my opinion.
Updating IFE for every flight on a weekly bases getting broadcast rights for new programmes, agreed advt opportuniteis are there but does it justify buying the rights of certain programmes,
Meal costs --an avg economy airline meal cost 8-12 USD and the way VJM does it i am sure its more----in the case of DN negligible food and entertainment cost.
His future businees plan is based purely on chance----If the dgca reduces the flying limit to 3 yrs or he acquires/starts an airline USA--does he really think it is as simple as that look at the probleem a dude like Richard Branson is having with Virgin America.
Some of yoll may argue that he will do well in International market--he might just but he has to survive till then---What if the flying rights are even reduced to 3 yrs [may 2008 for him] what does he do with 2 A330-200s that he will recieve for around 6-8 mths prior???
will it be done in time for him to acquire market share because by then the market will probably be saturated with 9W/AI and the foreigners AF/BA/LH/SQ flooding the market with WB Cheap tickets and Convinient connections as they have deep pockets. and to have a first movers advantage.
Agreed VJM also has deep pockets but are they as deep as the govts. of France Sin Germany England--also will his Shareholders approve him withdrawing funds from UB grup holdings considering that his airline is using 50-60 lakhs a day.
Even when it comes to 9W they are in certain situations that are similar to KingFisher but varaibly different in a good kind of way for 9W--yoll know what i am referring to i do not need to state the Obvious.
Karan |
ROCKING!!!!!!!! I wanted to write almost all the points you mentioned above but didn't take the pain to do so  ....you did it.
As far as the long run is concerned...even if Mallya stands till then who knows what might be his status then? If he's domestic flights are bringing him losses of 200-300crores than what the hell profits would he get even if he managed them...besides Mallya still has to pay for the wide bodies he's ordered.
As Karan wrote and i have already pointed out in my previous posts... IFEs on ATRs are useless. Yes a passenger would want an IFE even in the BEST bus services but talking from profit point of view its a loss-making idea!!!
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karatecatman
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 5:17 pm Post subject: Re: Is IT worth the fuss?? |
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| Karan69 wrote: |
I have taken the trouble to write so please take a few moments of your life to read it.Karan |
Karan -- Great!
| Karan69 wrote: |
His future businees plan is based purely on chance----If the dgca reduces the flying limit to 3 yrs or he acquires/starts an airline USA--does he really think it is as simple as that look at the probleem a dude like Richard Branson is having with Virgin America.Karan |
There is perhaps a little more to this. BA may have a role to play in influencing this decision even though the US claims otehrwise.
What the US authorities have said is that though the basic point is that "though the new low-cost airline called Virgin America is not under the actual control of US citizens", they have considered complaints by major carriers from across the Atlantic also in this decision.
The US Department of Transportation has officially said in a statement that Virgin America would have to revise its ownership, corporate structure and other agreements to be 75 per cent owned and controlled by US citizens before it can receive an operating certificate. It was ‘‘tentatively denying’’ the request for US certification, giving the group the opportunity to appeal.
| Karan69 wrote: |
Some of yoll may argue that he will do well in International market--he might just but he has to survive till then---What if the flying rights are even reduced to 3 yrs [may 2008 for him] what does he do with 2 A330-200s that he will recieve for around 6-8 mths prior???Karan |
With the A380 schedule slipping further (BBC says there are unofficial reports that a further delay might be announced soon), VJM's plans might get affected.
| Karan69 wrote: |
Agreed VJM also has deep pockets but are they as deep as the govts. of France Sin Germany England--also will his Shareholders approve him withdrawing funds from UB grup holdings considering that his airline is using 50-60 lakhs a day.
Karan |
Mallya's prime mission now is to get hold of Whyte & Mackay’s stocks of aged Scotch whisky and plans to borrow cash heavily against United Spirits’ balance sheet to finance the transaction. Company sources say his UB Group may raise further funds by placing up to 18 percent of its stock on the market and hinted at resources from Kingfisher Airlines also.
The cost price for Whyte is 500 million pounds. (A BBC television report again). So the situation at Kingfisher is going to be interesting.
His "confidence" that "IT will not go belly-up" in the Thapar interview is also interesting. It was just after this interview that his plans for Whyte were announced. |
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HAWK21M
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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Was Def talking about the Car 
regds
MEL
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C-GHKR
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the_380
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:26 pm Post subject: Re: Kingfisher's LIVE TV |
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| tsk911 wrote: | | Saw this news on India TV. Kingfisher becomes world's 2nd airline after jetBlue, USA to launch Live TV service. |
Its not possible that IT is the second airline...even some other European airlines have live satellite connections but definately IT is not second
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tsk911
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| Posted: Thu Dec 28, 2006 10:48 pm Post subject: Re: Kingfisher's LIVE TV |
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[quote="C-GHKR"] | tsk911 wrote: | | Saw this news on India TV. Kingfisher becomes world's 2nd airline after jetBlue, USA to launch Live TV service. |
I have already cleared the confusion regarding the same in one of my previous posts.
Lets wait and watch if 9W goes for TATA Sky Live TV...
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Karan69
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:07 am Post subject: |
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| tsk911 wrote: | | If VJM is able to impress shareholder, then why won't they agree? Even though there is time left for IT to go public, but if people are guaranteed high returns, then they won't be reluctant to invest. Moreover, if tomorrow VJM announces lucrative schemes for shareholders? What say? VJM is quite unpredictable and guessing his next move cent % right is impossible. |
Dude on what will he impress his shareholders on a freaking game of chance---5 yrs or less for international rights or starting the so called KF International by acquiring/starting a small US Airline subject to DOT and FAA approval--No shareholder will give permission to withdraw funds in such a risky game unless they see something concrete.
Karatecatman :
Thanks for the information on Virgin America but still i am sure it is not going to take VJM 8-10 mths to start an airline in USA even though his children are US citizens, the funding sources will be highly questionable as most will come from UB group which is a Foreign Company [For US].
Where Funds are concerned it even took USA 2 yrs to clear 9W for flights so i really see no chance of KF international happening before 2009 if ever.
Thanks for the update on the Whitnay Spirits takeover.
With regards to the A380 possible further delay
How does that put him in any better situation he has 10 Widebodies coming in before that the 5 A330-200s and the load restricted A340-500 HGW where the F*** is he gonna put them if the Rights are not given to him
Even if he gets to fly international from 3 yrs [May 2008] where the heck is he gonna put the
A330-200s---Are not the 320-321s tailor made for the SE Asian and Middle eastern routes especially since they got IFE and there is ample competition.
So the 332s go --One to LHR one to HKG and One to PVG/PEK what abt the other 2.
Pls keep in mind competition before blindly mentioning a route from the city you come from and keep in mind year round viability of the route not just the one flight you will take
A340-500s HGW---these aircraft are beautiful but severly load [not range restricted] so even if he fills up the BLR-SFO flight pax wise will he be able to trn it into profit----
BLR-SFO 2
???-NYC 2 1 spare and 3x weekly to some other place.
Karan |
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tsk911
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 4:43 am Post subject: |
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Karan ...CHILL...I mentioned that it's time for Kingfisher to go public, so as of now, even if he gets the rights to go international, he is on his own. No public backing as of now...
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HAWK21M
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 9:19 am Post subject: |
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What would be the chances of VJM Subleasing these Aircraft to other Operators in case things get tough.Will the cash flow be hit.....Presumingly he did.
regds
MEL
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the_380
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | What would be the chances of VJM Subleasing these Aircraft to other Operators in case things get tough.Will the cash flow be hit.....Presumingly he did. |
Then Mallya wouldn't be able to boast of his 'brand-new aircraft' ... no airline would prefer leasing aircraft unless they have ample ...
| Quote: | | Thanks for the information on Virgin America but still i am sure it is not going to take VJM 8-10 mths to start an airline in USA even though his children are US citizens, the funding sources will be highly questionable as most will come from UB group which is a Foreign Company [For US]. |
Branson currently has huge business in the USA most famous are the Virgin Malls ... Still the US govt didn't trust him
| Quote: | | How does that put him in any better situation he has 10 Widebodies coming in before that the 5 A330-200s and the load restricted A340-500 HGW where the F*** is he gonna put them if the Rights are not given to him |
Mallya is ruined incase he doesn't get the Rights to fly intl ... and im sure he won't prefer leasing them but instead he'll offer the slots to some other airline who must have ordered similiar aircrafts and delay his aircrafts' delivery
| Quote: | BLR-SFO 2
???-NYC 2 1 spare and 3x weekly to some other place |
Supposed to be BOM-NYC (EWR/JFK) and ???-JNB ... 3x week
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HAWK21M
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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VJM might be taking an Interesting gamble out here.
Time will tell.
regds
MEL
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tsk911
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| Posted: Fri Dec 29, 2006 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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VJM n gambling...along with some Scotch... seems like a true Kingfisher style business....
Peeyo Aur Peene Do.
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VABBy
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 11:46 am Post subject: |
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Just incase Doctor Mallya doesnt gets the rights to fly international i guess the fashion of deploying widebody jets wub be back thanks to IT
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saurabhm_101
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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wasnt there some rumor of his first international flight to be BOM/DEL-Johannesburg ?
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the_380
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| Posted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| saurabhm_101 wrote: | | wasnt there some rumor of his first international flight to be BOM/DEL-Johannesburg ? |
Supposed to be operated with Kingfisher Internationa using A330s at the ofset then replaced with A340s
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tsk911
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 3:30 pm Post subject: |
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| VABBy wrote: | | Just incase Doctor Mallya doesnt gets the rights to fly international i guess the fashion of deploying widebody jets wub be back thanks to IT |
Nah...I don't think so... Can't we have Kingfisher Leasing Ltd. or something like this???....VJM has money...and money can buy great brains, so I suppose that VJM will be able to find a way out...
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Boeing7xx
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 5:41 pm Post subject: |
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| Speculation! Speculation! Speculation! |
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the_380
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| tsk911 wrote: | | Nah...I don't think so... Can't we have Kingfisher Leasing Ltd. or something like this???....VJM has money...and money can buy great brains, so I suppose that VJM will be able to find a way out... |
Only possible if IT decides to stop operations.
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tsk911
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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Not necessary... VJM already owns a conglomerate, stepping into another business doesn't means closing down of others.
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the_380
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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| tsk911 wrote: | | Not necessary... VJM already owns a conglomerate, stepping into another business doesn't means closing down of others. |
Dude what i mant was that no airlines would like to lease aircrafts outto other airlines unless they have in excess or something like that. Giving aircraft on lease is as good as leasing your OWN car. Would you like to lease out your own car to someone just for the sake of money? If you have ample you might but not if you have just one... i mean considering your requirements.
Same way ... only if IT stops then he might lease them out or sell them
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tsk911
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| Posted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| the_380 wrote: | | tsk911 wrote: | | Not necessary... VJM already owns a conglomerate, stepping into another business doesn't means closing down of others. |
Dude what i mant was that no airlines would like to lease aircrafts outto other airlines unless they have in excess or something like that. Giving aircraft on lease is as good as leasing your OWN car. Would you like to lease out your own car to someone just for the sake of money? If you have ample you might but not if you have just one... i mean considering your requirements.
Same way ... only if IT stops then he might lease them out or sell them |
What I am referring to is what someone wrote in a previous post that what if IT is not allowed to fly international, then he might use the widebodies at domestic routes...
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the_380
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:03 am Post subject: |
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| tsk911 wrote: |
What I am referring to is what someone wrote in a previous post that what if IT is not allowed to fly international, then he might use the widebodies at domestic routes... |
They might...strong possibility...especially if 9W starts the wide body in domestic trend...even IT will do it...most probably might deploy the A330s
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saurabhm_101
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:24 pm Post subject: |
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i think IT will start first and then 9W will follow as usual....
cheers!
happy 2007!
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himmat01
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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The good old days of wide bodied a/c on domestic sectors will be back soon. I really miss the IC A300s on BOM-DEL.
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AKLDELNonstop
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| Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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Would the economics of the 330 allow the route to be more profitable, if it replaces two 320 flights or are 2 320 flights more profitable than one 330 on say BOM-DEL. That is assuming both options have full flights.
Cheers
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karatecatman
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:23 pm Post subject: KingFisher WORLD first? -- IFE on ATR-72 |
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Kingfisher Airlines has announced the induction of what it claims to be the world’s ‘‘first and only’’ ATR 72-500 aircraft facilitating in-flight entertainment system.
The aircraft is the sixth ATR 72-500 delivered to Kingfisher Airlines. All ATR aircraft delivered to Kingfisher will be equipped with in-flight entertainment system, it has said in a statement, and released on NDTV.
The new aircraft will have 17 LCD colour screens spread throughout the cabin. The TV screens operate on a drop down mechanism. No headphones or earphones are required since the audio comes through overhead speakers.
The airline also has announced operations from Trichy/Tiruchirappalli as a daily Bangalore-Trichy-Bangalore segment effective from January 10.
The flight will depart from Bangalore at 1.30 pm and arrive Trichy at 2.25 pm on all week days.In the return direction the flight would leave Trichy at 2.55 pm and reach Bangalore at 3.50 pm.
On Sundays the flight would depart Bangalore at 10.30 am and arrive Trichy 11.25 am.In the return trip the departure from Trichy would be at 11.55 am and reaching Bangalore at 12.50 pm.
Kingfisher will be the fourth airline company to operate from Tiruchirappalli after Indian Airlines, Sri Lankan Airlines and Air Deccan.
However, Air India Express will not commence flights from Dubai to Trichy as the technical team has expressed doubts about the runway length and strength for handling the 737-800. |
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himmat01
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 1:35 pm Post subject: Re: KingFisher WORLD first? -- IFE on ATR-72 |
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| karatecatman wrote: | . No headphones or earphones are required since the audio comes through overhead speakers.
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That's very strange. It will be like traveling in a state transport bus.
Reputed bus operators like Raj National Express also offer individual head phones.
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Nimish
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 2:10 pm Post subject: Re: KingFisher WORLD first? -- IFE on ATR-72 |
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| karatecatman wrote: | Kingfisher Airlines has announced the induction of what it claims to be the world’s ‘‘first and only’’ ATR 72-500 aircraft facilitating in-flight entertainment system.
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I thought their existing ATRs already had IFE with a PTV per seat Isn't that the case?
In which case why would they add another sub-type to their fleet without the PTVs on each seat??? |
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karatecatman
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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Nimish,
Plz check these two links. Apparently all the ATRs delivered are to be retrofitted with IFE.
http://tinyurl.com/u9v95
Also there is some intersting information about how IT (Kingfisher) is looking at IT(!!!) (Information tech) in preparation for flights abroad.
http://tinyurl.com/ymghbh |
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the_380
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 2329
Location: Mumbai, India
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| Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2007 5:20 pm Post subject: |
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| karatecatman wrote: | Nimish,
Plz check these two links. Apparently all the ATRs delivered are to be retrofitted with IFE.
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That means Mallya still has a chance to do something sensible.
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stealthpilot
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 2325
Location: BLR, DXB
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| avbuff wrote: | on domestic the IFE's are switched off only after 15 mins of take off and switched off when the descend starts .. so nearly half an hour the IFE systems are of no use
so on many routes 45 mins to 1 hr live tv wont matter passengers much .. |
Why don't they just leave the IFE on? Is it a law that they can only turn it on 15 mins after TO? Jet Blue leaves it on all the time. Besides, people can eat and watch TV at the same time 
I for one seem to like the idea. On short flights I believe LiveTV is a better idea than pre-loaded channels. It adds to costs sure, but IT is not trying to squeeze money out of everything, they want to be a luxury airline and satellite TV is the way to go. People sit around catching up on news at airports etc, so even on a 1 hour flight if you can offer a good set of channels people will love it (and pay for it hopefully). Besides, in a cricket crazy country like ours, you can bet IT will push the fact that you can watch the world cup/any matches live in the air, and not have to worry about anything.
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himmat01
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Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 1392
Location: DEL
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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Back in the 1980s, whenever there was a cricket match involvining, a lot of passengers would request the captain to get the update from ATC and announce the score. I have experienced this once or twice.
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